From a purely practical standpoint, and IF you were inclined to do a swap at all, the LS is certainly an interesting option. But, to a die-hard Mopar guy like me that could be considered blasphemy. You COULD do a Hemi swap, and while it may cost a few hundred more, in the end you may find you're getting more motor. I've seen a 5.7 Hemi in a gen1 (89) Dakota, it fits, and I'm keeping that as a possible future option for mine.

Here's an article from HotRod - 627 HP from a 5.7 Hemi for $3831 (includes cost of the motor). The article compares Hemi swap advantages/disadvantages to both Chevy LS, and Ford motors:
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/hrdp-...d-hemi-engine/

A quote from the article:
So, certainly worth considering.

 

IMO, one thing is for sure, New Hemi's, LS motors, etc., do offer more potential in a street vehicle compared to SBC, SBM, etc.
I do understand wanting to keep a dakota, ( mopar parts only.) Personally, I like going to shows, and reading about a variety of vehicles. Model T's with hemi's or chevy power. I like them all. But again, I do understand and respect brand loyality by anyone.
The article with the turbo added to the hemi is interesting. My concerns would be.
1. They spoke of a SCT tuner. I believe the intent would be to use this engine in an existing Hemi vehicle. They did mention using an aftermarket computer on the dyno.....
2. Can the factory computer, for a hemi, be converted to stand alone use? If not, aftermarket ususally will run in excess of $2,000.00
3. What does it take to mount the Hemi, to the dakota?

For the LS
1. Stand alone wiring harness, or converting an existing harness to stand alone is common place.
2. The LS computer is easy to tune. I have been told that there are some who even adapt it to the new hemi's due to the ease of tuning.
3. motor mount adapter plates are available for $100.00 to put the LS in a dakota.

But, all of that aside, IMO a 600 hp motor in a mostly stock dakota is going to be down right dangerous.....

I still believe that 250-350 hp is pushing the limits of the suspension, brakes, etc of a 1st gen dakota. Im staying with a magnum!!

 

That's a well thought out response 93RT, and you picked up on a couple things I skimmed right past. The engine management choices do include the factory ECU, and going that route with a hemi its best to get everything from the same donor. Otherwise, There's Holley's Hemi system (probably $$), or Megasquirt at the low end (requires nerdiness). I'm sure there are more nowadays, as the hemi aftermarket is growing, but I haven't kept up.

Mounting plates would be needed for the motor, though I would find fabbing those up a relatively easy job. Not so great if you're looking to do everything "off the shelf" though, I admit. You might need a trans plate too. The hemi has the same bellhousing pattern as any small block mopar, but there's a difference in the depth if you decide to use a pre-hemi transmission, so there's that.

A question unanswered is the oil pan. I understand that hemis used in trucks are rear sump, so they might work in a Dakota.

I believe it may necessary to go with the smaller diameter brake booster too, based on a picture I've seen.

The 1st gen Dak, and most other vehicles from the 80's or 90's weren't designed for that kind of power, so anyone wanting to put 400+ HP into one would be crazy not to upgrade the brakes, and preferably the suspension too. A stock Hemi would be sufficient for me; it would have about as much power as I'd want to deal with, the capacity to deliver it without the "explosiveness" of a big block wedge, and it's weight wouldn't give the Dakota a front-end weight problem and the handling issues that come with that.

I love a challenge, and there are some questions that need to be answered on a hemi swap. But heck, someone needs to just start the learning process!

 

I happened across the Dodge Dakota Shelby Registry and found this. It's the stats on a '89 Shelby Dakota, serial #545, modified obviously:

Would love to hear the story behind this swap.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by ragged89

I happened across the Dodge Dakota Shelby Registry and found this. It's the stats on a '89 Shelby Dakota, serial #545, modified obviously:



Would love to hear the story behind this swap.

Sounds like a heck of a nice truck!!

Ragged, FWIW I have a 93 corvette, with a built 385ci engine....... I took it to a place in Va beach to have it dyno tuned. Not complaining about their work, but it cost me a little over $2,000.00 to be tuned and replace injectors, which I supplied. Again, not complaining, they spent alot of time on it, and did a good job. I have dyno sheets showing 462 rwhp 398 tq. Its ran a 11.19 at 124.6 mph. with a 3000 stall converter that was not locking up. I now have a 4400 converter and Im hoping to get a 10 sec. time slip!!

I mention this for a reason. I tried to do my own tuning. On my car, you burn a chip, datalog and then make further adjustments, burn again, etc. There are PE tables, VE tables, and literally 100 other perimeters to take into consideration and adjust. IMO it takes a lot of time and experience to learn to do this correctly. Im 56 and dont care to learn all of this.

That being said, it seems that by the mass of the LS computers out there, that are being hacked, or retuned, and the knowledge to do this seems alot more common...... Therefore, many dyno shops are very familiar with the LS computer and will tune it at a reasonable price.

On the other hand, trying to tune a OBD1 computer, such as my 93 corvette has, takes much more time, and there are very few tuners with the knowledge, and are willing to tune it.

I have heard that the Hemi computers are hard to tune, and that there is little aftermarket support for it. I have even heard that there are some people who have adapted the LS computer to the Hemi motor, just because it is easier to tune.

For myself, a 5.9 carbed magnum will basically double the hp and torque that my truck is making now. In time, I may add a small cam, and a set of eq heads.

If I ever decide to go EFI I will look at FI-Tech or Holley Sniper, etc. Something that is self learning, or easy to have tuned. But I am in no hurry to go back down the EFI rabbit hole!!

As the old saying goes, "A man has to know his limitations" and for me, EFI is a big limitation!!

 

I've been giving it my best to promote a modern hemi swap into a Dakota, as I think it would be an interesting and fitting combination. Many owners don't realize that the 1st generation Dakota's suspension was used in development of the Viper's front suspension, or that these trucks were the first to incorporate rack and pinion steering (in a truck). Carrol Shelby probably recognized some of these attributes in the Dakota ( or maybe it was just a bean-counter's decision, lol). Anyway, I see the early 2WD Dakota as a truck that had potential beyond its time, and with suitable modification, like the modified Shelby above, it could be made into a quite decent street machine. Using a hemi to build this machine is just a nice way to build on that Mopar foundation, but that's just a personal preference, the LS would do just as well. The key is that these modern engines, are lighter (to preserve handling) and yet much more powerful in stock form. I would only look to do major HP mods to the engine if I were building a vehicle for the strip, and in that case I'd probably choose another platform. I'm not put off by the complexities of getting involved with fuel and timing on new engines, but that's me. I built my own MegaSquirt to use on my Neon RT a few years ago, just to learn. It opened my eyes to just amazing it can be combining electronics with engines.

Having said all that I have to confess, going with the LS is almost certainly a simpler swap, primarily because its been proven a few times in Dakotas, and the motor itself is well supported. It's also pretty obvious that parts to do the job will be more affordable. If someone is looking for a relatively easy path to modern V8 power in a Dak, its difficult to argue with the Chevy LS. For someone who wants to avoid the hardest knocks of car building, or someone who just doesn't have the time, they should be very glad for the option.

Your take is always worth reading RT93, and you make it hard to argue with your logic. About all I can offer in response is - aren't there enough Chevy SB's in this world for pete's sake? Incidently, that's one fast Corvette too, nice job!

 

Ragged, I agree, a hemi in a 1st gen. would have the most wow factor. I understand, with EFI there is much to be gained vs a carb, especially in a street motor. Its not just economy, but a radical motor can be tamed down a lot with EFI. With your experience and abilities, that would be the way to go.
If you dont mind me asking, what is your opinion on the self tuning EFI systems such as fi-tech or holley sniper?
Also, with the early 4wd dakota's (87-90) have you found a source for a upgrade for swaybars, or front disc? Eventually I plan to put a 8.8 ford rear under mine. The one I have has disc brakes and a swaybar, so I planned to adapt it to my truck, but a heavier front sway bar and better brakes would be nice!!

 

IMO these particular self-tuning systems are a dream come true for two reasons: 1) they can easily provide EFI on previously carbed engines, or on any power plant where the idea is to maintain an old-school appearance to the engine, and 2) they do it simply - so simply that anyone with basic mechanical skills can tackle the job successfully. The fact that it looks like a carb will probably make it easier for some guys to accept, lol. Icing on the cake is that the cost is now getting very attractive, and I didn't realize just how attractive until I took a look after seeing your post (thanks). I'm still partial to MPI over TB, because it delivers the fuel closer to the final destination, which has advantages, but that's quibbling. These systems are designed to replace and resemble carbs, and they seem to have done it well.

Heck, you can still program the FITech units too. They could probably entice even more old school guys if they developed programming to replicate the lumpy idle of the radically cammed, big carb engines.

I don't have an answer for you on the front sway bar, but it should be possible to adapt a larger bar from another application. Would require some measurements and homework, but I'm sure something exists that would work, maybe even one from a later Dakota could be adapted.

Regarding brakes, I remember reading somewhere that 80's to early 90's full size trucks and Ramcharger disc assemblies will bolt on to an early Dakota. I don't know if this applied to 4WD Daks, or just 2WD though. I'll see if I can locate the source of that info again.