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Cold Air Intakes

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  #1  
Old 03-13-2012, 11:55 AM
Libtech Libtech is offline
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Default Cold Air Intakes

I am looking at buying a used AirRaid Cold Air Intake for my 2005 Hemi. The guy said he paid $300+ for it and is asking $120. He said its simply installation just the box and filter and uses the stock piping? It doesnt sound like you even need to remove the Hemi Hat, does that make sense?

I thought he best ones to get for the Hemi were new piping and you end up removing the Hemi Hat?
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Old 03-13-2012, 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Libtech View Post
I am looking at buying a used AirRaid Cold Air Intake for my 2005 Hemi. The guy said he paid $300+ for it and is asking $120. He said its simply installation just the box and filter and uses the stock piping? It doesnt sound like you even need to remove the Hemi Hat, does that make sense?

I thought he best ones to get for the Hemi were new piping and you end up removing the Hemi Hat?
You did not mention what engine size you have, but looking on the Airaid website at 2005 Dodge Ram (I put 1500 5.7 in the type) these are the models i came up with:

http://www.airaid.com/ProductSearch.aspx

It seems many of them come with no piping at all and do cost over $300 so i would say they guy sounds like he is honest. And that price is fair. My suggestion is buy it, then order the Airaid Modular Intake Tube which sells for about $120 for a 5.7 version and $110 for a 4.7 version. That tube will replace all the stock intake piping including the Hemi Hat. You will end up with a full Cold Air Induction kit from Airaid. But if you opt to keep the stock setup, you will still be fine. Unless you are running headers and ported heads/intake and a high flow throttle body, the Hemi Hat and stock tubes are not going to be an issue.

And if you decide against buying this filter from the guy, LET ME KNOW! Ill buy it at that price!
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Old 03-13-2012, 12:10 PM
SLT8 SLT8 is offline
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Link without tube -
Part # 300-125-1
Price: $269.99
http://www.airaid.com/ProductDetail....ctID=300-125-1

Link w/ tube
Part # 300-150
Price: $369.99

http://www.airaid.com/ProductDetail....ductID=300-150
Product install pic.
Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 03-13-2012, 12:13 PM
NV290 NV290 is offline
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One that required a tube that i got off good images. 03 5.7.
That tubs is the same as the MIT (Modular Intake Tube) i bought for my truck. It's nice they sell it seperatley so people can remove the Hemi Hat and keep the stock air box, or down the road they can upgrade to a full CAI. Nice design.
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Old 03-13-2012, 12:16 PM
Libtech Libtech is offline
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Yeah I have a 5.7. Its that one you show in the picture. Is it a CAI though? That seems like its open design to the engine bay so it will just suck in warm air?
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Old 03-13-2012, 12:34 PM
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Yeah I have a 5.7. Its that one you show in the picture. Is it a CAI though? That seems like its open design to the engine bay so it will just suck in warm air?
That is classified as a CAI. The shroud is designed to keep the heat away as does the rubber seal against the hood.
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Old 03-13-2012, 01:30 PM
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I don't know what the technical distinction is that makes a CAI a TRUE CAI, but in the Official Book of Hammer, if it's not pulling air directly from outside the vehicle it's not a true CAI. To me if it's snorkeled or a Vararam it's a true unit and what most everyone (me included) has is basically taking warm air - just more of it.

I like the Vararam but for me it's not an option, where it gets it's air from I often have water up to.

To the OP, $120 is a good deal, but you can still make one that's just as effective and have half that in it and that's using a better filter besides...
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Old 03-13-2012, 01:57 PM
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I don't know what the technical distinction is that makes a CAI a TRUE CAI, but in the Official Book of Hammer, if it's not pulling air directly from outside the vehicle it's not a true CAI. To me if it's snorkeled or a Vararam it's a true unit and what most everyone (me included) has is basically taking warm air - just more of it.
I agree. I was simply pointing out for marketing purposes, that is classified as a CAI. But both of you are right, if you are drawing air from the engine compartment it's NOT cold air. Adding a giant free flowing filter to the same location in the engine compartment the stock airbox was is not going to miraculously give you colder air. In fact, the stock airbox would likley be better at giving cold air since the intake snorkel on the stock air box is directed towards the fender area. The bottom line is it's all marketing lingo. The reality is these "Cold Air Induction" systems are actually "High flow induction" systems. They certainly flow more air then stock, but colder? No.

I had a true CAI in my 06' Impala SS. The filter was mounted outside the engine compartment behind the front bumper. So you were never getting hot engine air. The trouble was, any time their was a heay rainstorm with big puddles on the highway, i would blow out my MAF Sensor. After the third time, i removed the CAI and just put a larger filter in the engine compartment corner. I noticed very little difference in power. The maybe 5 -8 HP i picked up from colder air was not worth the price and aggrivation factor of having to replace sensors from water damage.
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Old 03-13-2012, 02:23 PM
SLT8 SLT8 is offline
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Guess mine is considered a true CAI with the sacrifice of air conditioned air lol.
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Old 03-13-2012, 02:33 PM
Libtech Libtech is offline
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That's why I am wondering to be honest. The stock box pulls cold air from the front of the truck, not hot air under the hood.

If I put this AirRaid unit on, that isnt ducted from the front any longer I assume, which means is can move more air, but it will be hot air now.

Is it worth it? On top of that, I would gather I need to replace the piping to the throttle body as well and remove the hemi hat to get the most benefit.
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Old 03-13-2012, 05:16 PM
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That's why I am wondering to be honest. The stock box pulls cold air from the front of the truck, not hot air under the hood.

If I put this AirRaid unit on, that isnt ducted from the front any longer I assume, which means is can move more air, but it will be hot air now.

Is it worth it? On top of that, I would gather I need to replace the piping to the throttle body as well and remove the hemi hat to get the most benefit.
If your truck is mostly stock and you plan to keep it that way, then adding an intake system like any of the ones they offer will not offer you much performance. They all flow far more air then a stock engine can use. Your Throttle Body, Intake Manifold, Cylinder heads, valves, Exhaust Manifolds and Exhaust system as well as your ignition and fuel injection system are all designed to work with the induction system on your truck. Replacing just one component will not give you huge HP increases. They all work together to give you gains.

Cold air kits on a dyno will give you around 5HP or less. So little that you likley will not be able to even feel it. Unless you have headers, free flow exhaust and a larger Throttle body soon to be added, i would not worry about the CAI system.
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Old 03-13-2012, 07:14 PM
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I think alot of this is just hype. The whole CAI is just that. Manufacturers built a billion dollar enterprise from this one part. There are few ways to get a true CAI and the 3" pipe, filter, and shield are not going to give it to you. Only a True hood scoop with a short, insulated intake pipe would work.

What about all the heat passing through the radiator, eminating off the engine, and original temp of the air, does that not heat soak through the walls of the Airaid intake pipe? What about the "cool" air passing through the TB, does it still stay cool? What about inside the cylinders, Is it still cool in there? especially after (600 Rpm idle x 8 cylinders =4800/2=2400 explosions a minute. I really dont think so. The best affect you could get would be in the first 10 minutes of driving, before underhood temps reach max and the air passing through the grill and radiator can keep the temps down.

If you have a CAI with the filter mounted outside the engine bay and do not believe me then I ask you to complete one small experiment:

First,
After the truck has warmed up and idling nicely, open the hood and grab your CAI intake tube near the TB or grab the throttle body itself (as neither of these "create" heat by themselves during normal operation) and tell me it isnt hot. Not hot, well shouldnt it be pretty cold then. The air still has to travel through the TB, intake manifold, past the intake valves, and into the massively hot cylinder.

I know it sounds slanderous. I have been putting CAI's on every car Ive owned for the last 15 years. I just don't believe the reasoning that it actually can deliver "COLD" air.
I will continue to install the CAI, but I will have to agree with Hammer and NV290, and call them MAI (Mass Air Intake). The issue with mostly all actual CAI systems is water, like NV290 said and A snorkel system would work if it was insulated inside the engine bay.

I like the look, the thought, the perception is gives other people when they see it, and mostly, the sound.
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Old 03-13-2012, 08:24 PM
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That's why I've always recommend guys make their own. First off, it's gonna give the same gains any ebay or auto accessory store one is gonna give - unless you drop $500 or more on a true CAI. Secondly it does give a nice personal touch under the hood - and anybody who's payed any attention to either of my vehicles knows I'm into making my own sh*t to add a little bit of distinction as well as functionality. Third - you will see some gains, albeit a small one UNLESS you support it with other mods (headers, ported tb, heads, cam, etc.) where gains can be considerable. Lastly, one will give the exhaust sound a little better note...
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Old 03-13-2012, 08:39 PM
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I agree with the above on systems where the intake itself is drawing engine compartment air in. But an intake system with a hood scoop OR one that has an intake ahead of or under the radiator would help as well. "Cold" does not have to be by definition 40 degrees (as an example). The goal is getting COOLER air into the induction which can boost horsepower.

Having just installed a gauge yesterday that reads the Computer's IAT, i was able to see my actual inake air temp. It was 60 degrees yesterday outside and yet my IAT was reading 80 degrees. Even on the highway at 70MPH. The reason being is the induction is drawing air in from the engine compartment and the tube from the filter to the engine absorbs heat. So you are drawing in air that is heated from the exhaust manifolds as well from the radiator. Remember, all the cool air that passes through your radiator and takes the heat out of the water is now rushing into your engine compartment. It's HOT under the hood. All of these CAI kits are drawing air from the same place my filter is now, except they have an exposed element (i have the stock airbox) so you can be sure that the it will be picking up even more hot air compared to a stock air box which draws air in through the snorkel near the front fender. Ill bet it's cooler.

And all you need to do is get air from OUTSIDE the engine compartment to make a noticeable difference. It really makes no difference if some heat passes through the intake tubes from the ambient air in the engine compartment. Because that heat will still be much less then if you weere drawing actual air from under the hood. As an example, if like in my case, it was 60 degrees outside and my IAT was 80 since i was drawing air in from the engine compartment. If my inlet was under the bumper, the air would be much cooler then 80. But yes, their would be some increase in temp from the tubes themselves heating up. But still better then engine compartment air directly.
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Old 03-13-2012, 11:40 PM
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I do agree and the issue seems to stand with only one word: Cold. I do think cold is around 40 or so. Haha, but in this for instance, cold should be as cold as exterior temps +/- 5 degrees. A little better is better than standard, which we all seem to have our eye on, seeing the millions of posts a day on forums about mods.

So given a very rough standard, lets assume the 60 degree day and the 80 degree IAT temp. So you are seeing a 20 degree difference. From the fender of your truck to the IAT and the position of the IAT is relatively close to the TB. So inreality the temps are even higher as they pass through the TB and other components before combustion. This would be pretty close to the factory setup , except you may be pulling a couple more CFM's, which would also lower a couple degrees.

Everybody else not using the stock airbox for heat protection are gonna see higher temps. Probably 30 - 40+ degrees. Much less "Cold" than advertised, either way.

So as a finale, a stock airbox with filter unit is equal to a "CAI" system, unless the system is a "true CAI" with an external element, snorkel, or hood scoop. As I am sure the extra CFM's with a CAI equal out with the added temps that will be pulled in.

How are you viewing the IAT temps? I would like to do some test setups and see what is best, that way I can just do that for every vehicle in the future.
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Old 03-14-2012, 08:20 PM
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I ran 3" flexable plastic rain gutter down tubing from my stock air box (true flow filter) and TB tube. just below R fog light, I have no way to check IAT, but I am sure its cooler than sucking air from under the hood. Tubing was $10 BTW.
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Old 03-14-2012, 09:13 PM
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Originally Posted by slakker25rs View Post
So as a finale, a stock airbox with filter unit is equal to a "CAI" system, unless the system is a "true CAI" with an external element, snorkel, or hood scoop. As I am sure the extra CFM's with a CAI equal out with the added temps that will be pulled in..
Yes, i would agree. A CAI drawing air from in the engine compartment would see HIGHER air temps then the stock setup but at best, the same air temps. So the title of Cold Air Induction is completley flawed. It should be called "High Flow". Because that is all it is. No logical way to try and say a large air filter sucking engine compartment air will be cooler then then the stock setup which at least draws from an area away from the engine.

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How are you viewing the IAT temps? I would like to do some test setups and see what is best, that way I can just do that for every vehicle in the future.
AeroForce Interceptor. I have a thread on it active right now. And tonight i just drove home from work and again saw a 20 degree temp differential between the outside air temp and IAT. That was using my overhead display temp reading and the exterior temp the ECM is reading as well. They were within 3 degrees for the most part.
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Old 03-15-2012, 10:33 AM
SLT8 SLT8 is offline
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With the exception of idle, i was around 4-7 but never higher than than 10 degrees difference from my IAT temps to the temp showing on the overhead. Drive was around 35 miles w/ zone speeds of 65/55/40/35
IAT was using my SC3815

The longest idle at the light was about 18+ difference in temp which was a few minutes but i gotta try that again on the drive home.
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Old 03-15-2012, 12:53 PM
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What intake setup do you have?

Well I am going to do it today. I have your everyday standard CAI from ebay and I am going to see how close to a CAI i can get. Got all the supplies already.

Im thinking Flex aluminum pipe, into a filter housing, more flex aluminum, and insulation wrap for the whole thing. I think I can equal outside temps with this setup. I will take pics and how to if anyone wants. I just need a way to test it.

Im thinking of getting the flashpaq, but the $350 will make me have to wait on the brush guard and lights I want. I think the tuner is a better option, especially since im seeing my mpg fade. Im doing the o2 sensors tomorrow also.
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Old 03-15-2012, 01:48 PM
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I think one of the best things you could do to help the temp is to insulate the tube going from the air box to the Throttle body. Ill bet that is one of the biggest reasons for the increase in temp. No matter what it's made of, it soaks up heat from the engine and exhaust manifold below it and any air passing through it will be warmed.

Your plan to draw air from a source outside the engine compartment will help a lot. But you will still see a rise if you leave the tube uninsulated. I am going to look at some options and post what i find.
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Old 03-15-2012, 01:48 PM
 
 
 
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