electrical/lighting problem, completely lost
#1
electrical/lighting problem, completely lost
Hey,
06 ram 2500: my right rear turn signal, brake like and reverse light is not working. it's a very weird issue. Here are all the details.
*1. under normal operation and engine on, the rear turn signal is very dim or completely off and the right side blinkers blink at double speed.
*2. in accessory mode (before starting the truck) the turn signal is very bright and works as it should (blinks at normal speed).
3. if the lights are on, the tail lights work, but brake light doesn't.
4. Reverse lights don't work.
So i'm kind of at a loss. #1 and 2 are confusing me and i'm making the conclusion that its not a ground or wiring issue at least after the TIPM. What changes between accessory mode and run mode? The brake lights and reverse lights dont work, but i'm wondering if they were possible to operate in accessory mode, they would work there.
Can someone help me understand this issue?
06 ram 2500: my right rear turn signal, brake like and reverse light is not working. it's a very weird issue. Here are all the details.
*1. under normal operation and engine on, the rear turn signal is very dim or completely off and the right side blinkers blink at double speed.
*2. in accessory mode (before starting the truck) the turn signal is very bright and works as it should (blinks at normal speed).
3. if the lights are on, the tail lights work, but brake light doesn't.
4. Reverse lights don't work.
So i'm kind of at a loss. #1 and 2 are confusing me and i'm making the conclusion that its not a ground or wiring issue at least after the TIPM. What changes between accessory mode and run mode? The brake lights and reverse lights dont work, but i'm wondering if they were possible to operate in accessory mode, they would work there.
Can someone help me understand this issue?
Last edited by maddog2424; 07-15-2016 at 01:33 PM.
#4
First make sure that the ground to the rear lights is good. This is common to them all. I would check it with an ohmmeter, a test light is not accurate enough.
The other problems might go away with a good ground.
Is the no backup or brake light problem on both sides or just the right side?
The other problems might go away with a good ground.
Is the no backup or brake light problem on both sides or just the right side?
Last edited by Friar Tuck; 07-15-2016 at 02:06 PM. Reason: changed brake to rear on 1st line
#5
Now that i think of it, i think the reverse lights were out on both sides, which would probably put the cause of that to a different cause (that reverse switch on the auto transmission.
The brake light/turn signal problem is just on the right side. The rear right is the only area with any issues with anything.
I just can't understand why it would work well when the engine is not running, and go bad when the engine is on. Are those run on a different circuit within the TIPM? Is there a different power input on the TIPM depending on if engine is running or not? The ground shouldn't change when the engine starts.
The brake light/turn signal problem is just on the right side. The rear right is the only area with any issues with anything.
I just can't understand why it would work well when the engine is not running, and go bad when the engine is on. Are those run on a different circuit within the TIPM? Is there a different power input on the TIPM depending on if engine is running or not? The ground shouldn't change when the engine starts.
Last edited by maddog2424; 07-15-2016 at 03:21 PM.
#6
Oh sorry, i just checked again and the left reverse light works, the right doesn't.
Before starting, the turn signal works great. after starting, it dims down and flashes twice the speed. When turning the key off, the turn signal still blinks fast and dim until i turn key all the way off and back on to accessory
So in an attempt to talk this out and hopefully learn some incorrect assumptions i'm making...
the bulb is getting power and is properly grounded, atleast when the key is in the accessory position. That makes me think this isn't a ground issue. If someone thinks otherwise, please let me know. The bulb is getting power and works well. When i turn on the engine, the bulb immediately starts flashing double speed and much dimmer. with the assumption (maybe a bad one) of the ground being good, that means its no longer getting the correct amperage or the correct voltage (one of the 2, i'm not that good in electronics). I don't see how turning on the engine could effect the multifunctional switch for the rear right lights either...then again, i don't understand any of it... This makes me wonder if there is a change in output voltage from the tipm, although i'm not exactly how to check that. I'm not sure which connector/wire i need to check, or how i would get to it. It could also be tipm input. Once the engine is on, both battery and alternator are supplying power. Could this be an over power issue? I'm not sure that makes sense.
to me this kind of says there may be something wrong in the tipm. when in the accessory mode, i would guess the TIPM decides what is allowed and what isn't, possibly through a different circuit? As i'm typing that, i'm not sure if that is correct. Are there lights that cant be operated when in accessory position that can be in run position?
Anyone have comments on anything i've said? I'm just trying to find out where i'm off so i can realign and attempt to solve this thing.
**UPDATE**
another interesting thing. The brake light does not work in accessory mode. Emergency flashers do. When i hit the brake with the emergency flashers on, the right side stops blinking and also doesn't show the brake light. The left side keeps blinking and shows the brake light. Same thing with turn signal and it starts flashing double speed while brake pedal is depressed, but flashes normal when its released. Or maybe it is the ground, and when more than 1 light is running back there, the bad ground connection can't handle it.
Before starting, the turn signal works great. after starting, it dims down and flashes twice the speed. When turning the key off, the turn signal still blinks fast and dim until i turn key all the way off and back on to accessory
So in an attempt to talk this out and hopefully learn some incorrect assumptions i'm making...
the bulb is getting power and is properly grounded, atleast when the key is in the accessory position. That makes me think this isn't a ground issue. If someone thinks otherwise, please let me know. The bulb is getting power and works well. When i turn on the engine, the bulb immediately starts flashing double speed and much dimmer. with the assumption (maybe a bad one) of the ground being good, that means its no longer getting the correct amperage or the correct voltage (one of the 2, i'm not that good in electronics). I don't see how turning on the engine could effect the multifunctional switch for the rear right lights either...then again, i don't understand any of it... This makes me wonder if there is a change in output voltage from the tipm, although i'm not exactly how to check that. I'm not sure which connector/wire i need to check, or how i would get to it. It could also be tipm input. Once the engine is on, both battery and alternator are supplying power. Could this be an over power issue? I'm not sure that makes sense.
to me this kind of says there may be something wrong in the tipm. when in the accessory mode, i would guess the TIPM decides what is allowed and what isn't, possibly through a different circuit? As i'm typing that, i'm not sure if that is correct. Are there lights that cant be operated when in accessory position that can be in run position?
Anyone have comments on anything i've said? I'm just trying to find out where i'm off so i can realign and attempt to solve this thing.
**UPDATE**
another interesting thing. The brake light does not work in accessory mode. Emergency flashers do. When i hit the brake with the emergency flashers on, the right side stops blinking and also doesn't show the brake light. The left side keeps blinking and shows the brake light. Same thing with turn signal and it starts flashing double speed while brake pedal is depressed, but flashes normal when its released. Or maybe it is the ground, and when more than 1 light is running back there, the bad ground connection can't handle it.
Last edited by maddog2424; 07-15-2016 at 06:05 PM.
#7
Check the harness to the PCM. Ensure the harness is indeed solidly connected for each bundled connection.
Since your truck gives weird events when the key is in assy vs. engine start/run, the switch ma be flaky. Not sure if you will need to get the column trim off to clean it or check the wire connection to it.
Likewise with the column trim off, look at the connection to the turn signals too. Also the hazard 4-ways. Oddly, all the problems tend to be related to the steering column switches. Possibly take the knee bolster trim piece off and check connections or frayed wires along with ground down there.
Report back. It helps us to help you and others doing searches on this very topic.
Since your truck gives weird events when the key is in assy vs. engine start/run, the switch ma be flaky. Not sure if you will need to get the column trim off to clean it or check the wire connection to it.
Likewise with the column trim off, look at the connection to the turn signals too. Also the hazard 4-ways. Oddly, all the problems tend to be related to the steering column switches. Possibly take the knee bolster trim piece off and check connections or frayed wires along with ground down there.
Report back. It helps us to help you and others doing searches on this very topic.
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#8
oh, so all switches for hazards, brakes and turn signals are under the trim in the steering column? I was looking at the wiring diagram, not that i actually know how to read it, but it seems like the multi-funtional switch controls the turn signals and hazard. is the brake like and reverse lights on their own switches?
I would assume the pcm harness is on the back side of the TIPM? I did take it out because i suspected corrosion on the board (i read one post and jumped to that conclusion ). but all the wires and connectors looked to be in good condition, and were secure in the connector
I would assume the pcm harness is on the back side of the TIPM? I did take it out because i suspected corrosion on the board (i read one post and jumped to that conclusion ). but all the wires and connectors looked to be in good condition, and were secure in the connector
Last edited by maddog2424; 07-15-2016 at 06:50 PM.
#9
oh, so all switches for hazards, brakes and turn signals are under the trim in the steering column? I was looking at the wiring diagram, not that i actually know how to read it, but it seems like the multi-funtional switch controls the turn signals and hazard. is the brake like and reverse lights on their own switches?
I would assume the pcm harness is on the back side of the TIPM? I did take it out because i suspected corrosion on the board (i read one post and jumped to that conclusion ). but all the wires and connectors looked to be in good condition, and were secure in the connector
I would assume the pcm harness is on the back side of the TIPM? I did take it out because i suspected corrosion on the board (i read one post and jumped to that conclusion ). but all the wires and connectors looked to be in good condition, and were secure in the connector
Electrical problems are the worse. It could be something sooo simple, yet hardly detectable.
#10
WHO'S ON FIRST?!
The reason I mentioned checking battery voltage with the engine off, then again with it running is to see how much it changes with the alternator charging.
Don't assume that the grounds or even the bulbs and sockets are ok just because the light comes on. That's what I call a "garden path". If anyone isn't old enough to know what that means, it can lead you to a false conclusion. The best thing to do is verify, and you won't have to go there but once.
The reason I mentioned checking battery voltage with the engine off, then again with it running is to see how much it changes with the alternator charging.
Don't assume that the grounds or even the bulbs and sockets are ok just because the light comes on. That's what I call a "garden path". If anyone isn't old enough to know what that means, it can lead you to a false conclusion. The best thing to do is verify, and you won't have to go there but once.