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95 Ram Van 1500 318 won't start???

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  #1  
Old 10-20-2011, 09:21 PM
AT1957 AT1957 is offline
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Default 95 Ram Van 1500 318 won't start???

Problem started about a month ago, 1 day wouldn't start right off and eventually would later, last night wouldn't start (turns over great!), unplugged and plugged back coil, still no start, took fuses out and plugged back in and put jumper cables on and it did start, thought it was corroded fuse connection and thought it was fixed, today, will not start at all, pulled fuses again and checked and cleaned terminals and jumped it off as well to keep from draining battery, no start. Got new coil and unplugged old one and plugged new one in (however did not bolt to frame, just left hanging, still no start?) and ideas? Should I bolt new coil to frame to ground it? thought about this later??? Also, just to make sure it wasn't a fuel thing I sprayed some starting fluid in breather while cranking it, still wouldn't even try to crank.
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  #2  
Old 10-20-2011, 11:02 PM
alloro alloro is offline
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Has it been cooler outside in your area lately? When a PCM is on the verge of going bad it tends to not generate spark when its cool. You can try warming up the PCM with a hairdryer for a few minutes then try and seeing if the engine starts. If it does you've found the problem.
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Old 10-21-2011, 12:19 PM
AT1957 AT1957 is offline
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Default 95 Ram Van 1500 318 won't start???

Hate to sound ignorant, but I am. What and where is a PCM at?
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Old 10-21-2011, 10:42 PM
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The PCM is the vehicle computer called a Power Control Module.

It's located just under the front mini-hood at the top of the cowl line. There will be three wire-harness connections into a dull aluminum cover plate.
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Old 10-25-2011, 01:23 PM
jpbledsoe jpbledsoe is offline
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Problem started about a month ago, 1 day wouldn't start right off and eventually would later, last night wouldn't start (turns over great!), unplugged and plugged back coil, still no start, took fuses out and plugged back in and put jumper cables on and it did start, thought it was corroded fuse connection and thought it was fixed, today, will not start at all, pulled fuses again and checked and cleaned terminals and jumped it off as well to keep from draining battery, no start. Got new coil and unplugged old one and plugged new one in (however did not bolt to frame, just left hanging, still no start?) and ideas? Should I bolt new coil to frame to ground it? thought about this later??? Also, just to make sure it wasn't a fuel thing I sprayed some starting fluid in breather while cranking it, still wouldn't even try to crank.
Look at posts in this topic:

http://dodgeforum.com/forum/dodge-ra...nightmare.html
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Old 11-07-2011, 05:47 PM
AT1957 AT1957 is offline
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alloro, I first replaced some relays and it worked good for a few days, and then a couple of times it didn't want to start and eventually it would, one day it wouldn't, so I took your advice, took a blow dryer to it and it cranked immediately! So, sounds like a PCM, next question for everyone out there, where do you all recommend a reasonable place to get one?
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Old 11-07-2011, 10:01 PM
alloro alloro is offline
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Quote:
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where do you all recommend a reasonable place to get one?
Any unlocked van at least 4 streets away from yours.

Prices change, so post the number off the PCM and we can help look around. The number ends with 2 letters like AA, AB, BB, etc.
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Old 11-08-2011, 10:28 PM
jpbledsoe jpbledsoe is offline
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alloro, I first replaced some relays and it worked good for a few days, and then a couple of times it didn't want to start and eventually it would, one day it wouldn't, so I took your advice, took a blow dryer to it and it cranked immediately! So, sounds like a PCM, next question for everyone out there, where do you all recommend a reasonable place to get one?
I recently bought a A1-Cardone PCM for a 94 B350 at a local auto parts store. The cost was $232 after the $70 rebate for the old PCM.

In my case it was tax free because the van is a church van. Plus, I wanted to deal with a brick and mortar store in case I needed to return the unit right away. O'Reilly's said it has a 1-year free replacement warranty. O'Reilly's didn't ask for a part number of the existing unit. They didn't ask for the van's VIN. They just needed the standard info: year, model, engine size.

95 vans might be different; 95 might be the year when the PCMs could first be flashed (loading code in flash memory) for specific vehicles. In that case, you'd need to provide the van's VIN so the supplier can load the appropriate code. The supplier will ask for the VIN if it's required.

Good luck.

Last edited by jpbledsoe; 11-08-2011 at 10:30 PM.. Reason: inserting words, correcting grammar
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Old 11-09-2011, 02:01 PM
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any progress being done--patiently awaiting
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Old 11-22-2011, 02:31 PM
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Need further help from out there. Ordered a PCM from O'Reilly, came in, it was the wrong one. Box had the right # on it, but actual PCM in box was different # and it wouldn't start the van, they ran the #'s of the actual PCM in the box and showed it was for a 93 van, instead of a 95, so took it back to O'Reilly, they stated that was the only one to be found and can't find another one!? Auto Zone said the same thing! Said I could send it off to get rebuilt, but may take a month to get it mailed off and then get it back, etc.! Anyone have any other ideas? Correct PCM has a 8347 # on it. Van VIN # is: 2B7GB11Y0SK534006. If I could find a good used one that would be wonderful. Also, I'm not 100% sure it is the PCM, probably, but not sure, one thing that makes me think it is, is that I can quickly heat the PCM with a blow dryer & it cranks, BUT ALSO I can wiggle the BIG electrical plug that plugs into it & it will usually quit, however I guess that "could" be a crack or something in the PCM circuit board maybe behind the pins maybe??? Wonder if one could open it up & look for cracked circuit board??? OR do you think it is a messed up plug, "tried" to look at the plug to see if there were any broken wires, but very hard to tell, didn't see any obvious problems. Any advice from anyone would be tremendously appreciated...
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Old 11-22-2011, 03:50 PM
alloro alloro is offline
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Quote:
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Correct PCM has a 8347 # on it.
Could you post the whole number?
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  #12  
Old 11-22-2011, 04:02 PM
AT1957 AT1957 is offline
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There are several #'s, but here they are:
Module S/N - TEH347422592
under that # are #'s 16 15-35 2 BF
Also has: Chrysler P/N 56028347
then 5602 8347
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  #13  
Old 11-23-2011, 12:05 AM
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http://www.shipecm.com/index.php?rou...product_id=384

See, now wasn't that easy!

Last edited by alloro; 11-23-2011 at 12:08 AM..
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Old 11-23-2011, 02:08 AM
AT1957 AT1957 is offline
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THANKS! Hope that is it and not the plug...
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Old 11-23-2011, 11:00 PM
jpbledsoe jpbledsoe is offline
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THANKS! Hope that is it and not the plug...
The PCM is your best bet. It is very possible you're moving something around inside the PCM. The PCM is potted with silicone. When you take it apart, you'll see the heatsinks protruding from the silicone but you can't get to the circuits.

You're having a run of bad luck with O'Reilly's. Curious which brand of PCM you got from O'Reilly's. Borg Warner? A1 Cardone? Other?

After I captured my 94 van's PCM's failed coil drive signal with my oscilloscope, I removed the PCM connector and checked for continuity between the coil drive wire* and the applicable pin in the connector while tugging on the wire to check for a bad crimp in the factory wire harness. I had to remove the backshell (cover on the back of the connector) in order to get a good local grip on the wire so I could tug at it. The backshell was easy to unsnap and reinstall.

I also checked all the PCM's ground wires/pins (3 of them) at the connector in this manner. Then, I checked continuity between all those grounds and both the van chassis and the battery's negative terminal. All wires/pins associated with driving the coil checked good so I replaced the PCM.

I have an alldatadiy.com account for my 94 van so I knew exactly which connector pins to check. If you don't have a schematic with pin assignments, wire colors, and the connector's pin arrangement, you can't really check specific pins in the manner that I described above.

I hope your next PCM is a good match and fixes the problem with your van.

Jeff

* I used some of the insulation-piercing probes to connect to individual wires near the connector. The type of probes I speak of are show in the facebook pictures I provided a link to in an earlier reply.

Last edited by jpbledsoe; 11-23-2011 at 11:02 PM.. Reason: grammar correction and clarification
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Old 11-25-2011, 03:42 PM
AT1957 AT1957 is offline
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O'Reilly's ordered it through A1 Cardone, but they said they couldn't find anymore from anyone, of course, I'm not sure who else they actually checked with. I have ordered a PCM from shipecm, should be in soon. Had to use the van today to move some things, it didn't hardly want to start even using the blow dryer, but it did, but quit down the road, finally got it restarted, but this time I noticed a new thing, when it cuts off the radio power cuts out and then comes back on and when it comes back on it would start??? Where would I check for possible grounds, etc.
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Old 11-26-2011, 01:02 PM
jpbledsoe jpbledsoe is offline
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O'Reilly's ordered it through A1 Cardone, but they said they couldn't find anymore from anyone, of course, I'm not sure who else they actually checked with. I have ordered a PCM from shipecm, should be in soon. Had to use the van today to move some things, it didn't hardly want to start even using the blow dryer, but it did, but quit down the road, finally got it restarted, but this time I noticed a new thing, when it cuts off the radio power cuts out and then comes back on and when it comes back on it would start??? Where would I check for possible grounds, etc.
Pulled out the alldatdiy.com schematic prints for my 94 van. I don't know if the 94 and 95 have identical ignition wiring. Most likely, for basic areas like power switched to the PCM and radio, it will be the same. Others who know the differences between the 94 and 95 could provide that info.

The ignition switch has 4 positions: ACC, OFF, RUN, and START. I assume in both cases that you mentioned (radio on and radio off), you had the key in the RUN position, i.e., right before you started or attempted to start the engine. According to my schematic, power should be present at signals A21 and A31 when the ignition switch is in the RUN position. The ignition switch switches power to A21 and A31 from a single signal line: A1.

A21 provides 12V power to the coils of both shutdown relays (one relay switches power to the injectors and the ignition coil, the other relay switches power to the fuel pump). Without 12V at A21, the van won't start for multiple reasons: no spark, no fuel injector activation, and no fuel pumped from the tank.

A31 provides 12V power to the radio.

So, it's either an intermittent connection/splice in the 12V source to the ignition switch (A1, which is a solid red AWG 12 wire in the 94 van) or an intermittent failure in the ignition switch.

I'd try jiggling/torquing the ignition key while it's in the RUN position to see if you can make the radio go on and off. If that doesn't work, you most likely have an intermittent power source to the ignition switch. Try jiggling the key and let us know what you find. By the way, it's normal for the radio to go off when the ignition switch is in the start position to crank the engine.

Don't feel bad about ordering the PCM. If the old one was original, it needed replacing. The potting material in my van's old PCM had open splits in it and was falling apart (Texas and southern environments are especially hard on silicone potting). Any time the potting starts splitting like that, moisture intrusion and failure will follow. Plus, sounds like you got a good price.

If your tests don't indicate an intermittent in the ignition switch in the RUN position, I'll get into the details of tracking down problems with the wiring between the battery and the ignition switch.

Jeff

Last edited by jpbledsoe; 11-26-2011 at 01:04 PM.. Reason: capitalize a word
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Old 11-26-2011, 04:23 PM
AT1957 AT1957 is offline
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Thanks, I'll try some more wiggling on the key, etc. It may be??? more than one issue too, since it "usually" starts immediately after putting a blow dryer to the PCM and "usually" will quit when pressing on the big plug going into the PCM. It will be next week before the PCM gets here...
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Old 11-26-2011, 11:54 PM
jpbledsoe jpbledsoe is offline
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Thanks, I'll try some more wiggling on the key, etc. It may be??? more than one issue too, since it "usually" starts immediately after putting a blow dryer to the PCM and "usually" will quit when pressing on the big plug going into the PCM. It will be next week before the PCM gets here...
You're fortunate to have a situation where you can induce the failure.

I tried using a friend's pneumatic tools to stop my van by hammering at the connector's mounting bolt, the PCM's mounting screws, and the firewall near the PCM mounting screws. The van just kept running. However, I knew from the scope data that it had to be the PCM that was at fault.

Two or more failures can be discovered during troubleshooting a problem. I had that experience with an intermittent ignition failure on an 85 Toyota truck.
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Old 11-28-2011, 01:40 PM
AT1957 AT1957 is offline
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Thanks for the reply, when the PCM gets here maybe I'll know more. one problem not many REAL GOOD mechanics here, as far as electrical that is, had a couple look at it, but not much help... Trail and error for now...
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Old 11-28-2011, 01:40 PM
 
 
 
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