Ok guys, I'm really at my wits end with trying to find a decent CTD. I'm a first time buyer, and I'm looking for 98-02 mainly, and slightly considering 03-07's. Problem is, I've narrowed down over 30 trucks to this one that is clean as a whistle, checks out 100% mechanically, fairly low mileage (134k), and at a great price...Not even a nick in the cloth upholstery anywhere. Has a great CAI on it, with nice powdercoated black wheels and a beefy grille guard that has a step platform area so you can stand and work on the engine...basically has everything I want and wanted to add after-purchase...but only one setback: it's a dually.

My kinda driving is 200 miles/week in the city, sometimes traffic, sometimes not, and about 100 every other weekend of open road highway driving. I tow a few times a year currently (horse trailer or hay loads), but plan to tow more in the future. I have talked to a diesel tech friend that says they are a PITA when it comes to parking, buying new tires, etc., and I can handle that just fine. But he also said the gearing, rotors, brakes, etc. are beefed up and cost more to replace when worn down, moreso than SRW trucks, and that's my issue.

I respect his opinion and I realize exactly what he's talking about, but my dilemma is that the CTD's I find that are in my price range and in good shape, are almost all duallys for some reason, and I hate that this is the only setback to an otherwise ideal truck for myself. Also, right now I'm limited to looking at dealerships since I'm doing a trade-in. What I want to know is, what are your guys' experiences with owning a dually? Costwise, MPG difference (I've heard no difference, slight difference, and drastic difference concerning SRW vs DRW on this topic), and anything else. Is it worth it to wait and find a SRW Cummins? Or are the extra two wheels more of just a personal inconvenience to some?

 

Here is my question to you, what's wrong with ur current truck?

Reason most of them are dualley because ppl use them as a work horse, usually as a fleet vehicle, not a "tow few times a year".
your mechanic friend is correct, the CTD is a lot better work horse than a Gasoline truck, they can put up with a lot more abuse. However, their maintainence cost are significantly higher than a Gasoline counter part. Unless you plan to abuse the crap out of your truck, I think a Gasoline truck might be a more cost effective option for you.
If you are getting a Duelley Diesel, expect to pay ur mechanic friend A LOT of money for the years to come. Each visit to the shop can cost you over thousand easily. But if you are running a business with it as a Fleet, I would definitely get a Cummin Diesel, because they stay on the road.

If you need more power and less expensive truck, maybe try look for a newer 5.7l Hemi.

 

Right now I have a shortbed 4.7...I want a long bed since I frequently run out of space, and more power than a 4.7, and also more towing power. I don't have to go with a diesel of course, but I'd much rather prefer them for engine longevity and better mileage capability. The 3500 dually is of course a towing powerhouse, and I'd feel bad not using it to it's potential, but I can't seem to find a SRW cummins that's even near my budget that's in the same condition that the dually's are in, and I'm not sure why that is..they are really common out here.

I've of course considered 5.7 Hemi Heavy Dutys as well, but everytime I hear that diesel sound, I kinda forget about it. My MPG sucks as it is though, so if I go to a Hemi I hope it gets at least around the same as the 4.7...I'm not too familiar with the 5.7's, except that most out here were ex-fleets, which is something I'm also trying to avoid if possible.

 

the cummins needs less maintenance than a gasoline does...don't know where you are getting your info from...I change my oil every 15k-20k miles as a diesel does not destroy its oil like a gasoline does...a diesel engine wears 100x slower than a gasoline engine does, and there is just less parts to go wrong on a diesel than on the gasoline. not to mention like y'all said everything is heavy duty on the diesels, so unless you abuse the hell out of it, you are NOT going to break it. the transfer cases are heavier, the engines rotating assemblies are bullet proof, transmissions are a LOT stronger than the gas burner transmissions, and high mileage is not even a factor on them till they get up over 600k miles...

hemi has NOTHING on the cummins. doesn't even hold a candle to it.

you want power potential that is reliable...few thousand extra, just look at my signature: over 500hp/1000lbs/ft tq at the rear wheels and I daily drive it without any problems...every time a 3rd gen hemi tries to race me, they learn quick that they don't stand a chance lol.

btw you can buy a dually and convert it to single rear wheel...take the extended fenders off, and swap wheels, tires, and hubs out.

for $1500 you can get the hub conversion kit
http://www.emsoffroad.com/store/inde...roducts_id=330

the dually has the same bed as the SRW trucks with extended fenders glued on...just remove the fenders and buff out the marks where they were...

 

I appreciate your suggestions Jigabop. The only reason why I was considering a 5.7 is for the fact that maintenance is cheaper and maybe a diesel would be overkill since I'm not towing often at all, but as far as engine longevity, MPG, durability, etc., of course the CTD is going to trump the Hemi. And actually, the 2nd gen diesels out here are usually cheaper than the 5.7's, that's IF you don't get an ex-fleet...ex-fleets are a dime a dozen and usually in terrible shape around this area.

I spent several hours yesterday lurking Dually daily-driver topics on countless forums, and it seems the main concerns of dually owners is the 6 vs 4 tire purchase when it comes that time, and keeping in mind that you have wide hips when it comes to right turns, parking, etc. I really don't have an issue with that, I park far away as it is and in great physical shape, so if it means parking in no-man's-land, then so be it...less chance for someone to hit my truck with a shopping cart or their door! Only headache will be taking it into Hollywood, which is where I work most days. Anyways, I test drove the dually I'm looking at, and caught the curb with my wheel in 2 right turns, but after that I got used to it. It's loud, beastly, and quick for a stock diesel...wasn't expecting so much acceleration. It looks like it was babied, and it's at the right price, I may not even convert it to SRW if I do get it, just in case I end up using it to actually tow something significant. I'm still considering the 5.7, but it's at the back of my mind...they don't stack up to this cummins.

 

once again maintenance is more often on a gasoline than it is on a diesel.

think of it this way...what all do you have to do on a gas engine for a tuneup? change plugs, wires, cap, rotor, PCV, fuel filter, air filter, oil filter, and oil change....

diesel tuneup: change fuel filter, change air filter, change oil and oil filter if its due...drain puke bottle...that's it. no spark plugs or wires on it to change, no cap and rotor...

cummins is far more simple than a hemi. and far less parts to break, not to mention the cummins is built so damn tough especially from 2nd gen, that you really only have to worry about the injection pump and accessories going bad..the motor itself is extremely overbuilt. exactly how I was able to more than double my horsepower and torque without having to change any of my stock engine internals other than swapping out the head bolts for head studs.

my valvetrain is stock, rotating assembly is stock, intake is stock other than intercooler boots and turbos. and injectors are aftermarket, but rest is stock.

cummins will yield better fuel economy and be more friendly at being a daily driver than a gas engine. its literally superior in every way...don't let someone scare you off with maintenance costs. they are lower than you think.

oil changes are expensive due to oil capacity, but consider this: you change oil on gas engine every 3k miles? I change mine every 15k-20k miles...think its worth the extra money to go that much further since the gas engine will cost more due to it happening more frequent...

anyway its up to you in the end, but I will warn that a 2nd gen 24v cummins needs an aftermarket lift pump and fuel pressure gauge right out of the gate to be reliable. 2-stroke oil added to the fuel 128:1 ratio helps too to ensure the injection pump lives a nice long life.

I run wally world supertech. 1oz per gallon. never had a prob with my injection pump and I run 16-20psi fuel pressure at all times.

 

I am 100% agree on Cummin Diesel trumps the Hemi by 10 fold. But I am just saying which one is more cost effective for OP, because it sound like he's not using his truck to it's full potential to justify it.

Maintainence on Hemi? all you need is Spark Plug 30k, and conventional Oil Change every 3k, longer if Synthetic.
Cummin Diesel? Oil Change every 12K, and Fuel Filter every 12K.

Nothing is in-destructible, My point is, WHEN something do break, how much would it cost to fix it. That's what his Mechanic is trying to tell him. Have you priced out a Fuel Injector, or a Turbo Charger on a Cummin Diesel? Those things don't last as long as the Motor does.

Hemi is very strong motor in terms of Gasoline engine, you can still easily pull over 200k off the motor. It is a Single Cam push rod, 2 Valves per Cylinder motor like the LS series from General Motor.

If the buyer doesn't even plan on putting 100k miles on the truck for the next 5 years, Longevity of the motor might not even matter. The company I work at has a 1996 F350 Plow truck with a V8 Gas engine, that thing lasted longer any Plow truck we've owned. Gasoline Engine is sufficient if you aren't using it as a fleet vehicle.

 

Well I figure I can lower some of the costs of maintenance with a Cummins too by doing things myself...oil change, filters, etc. That's one thing that caught my eye, is that there's so much room to work, and identifying engine components is a breeze...if I look into my 1500 4.7, I'm lost, but give me a cummins and I can find just about anything after a few mins. I peered into my grandfather's Chevy small-block engine today in his Impala, and I was able to see and identify literally every component and piece of the engine, so what people have said, "cummins is the small-block chevy of diesel" are truly right...which gives a guy like me that's fairly new to engine mechanics a chance to learn, especially without taking apart half the engine.

I also did some research on parts, and it seems that there is a HUGE difference in injector pricing...as in a $250 leap going from '03 and above...being an '02, I can still get away with $100-a-piece injectors, which is glorious for my wallet and budget. The lift pump ain't so bad either...just the damn VP44, but I'm bracing myself for that. Now let me ask something...given that the VP44 looks like stock in this dually, and it's at 135k miles...when can I expect it to crap out? I was seeing usually in the 150k range. Could I get by a while without changing it immediately? And could I haggle the dealership to lower the price since it is still stock?

I was also told the brakes, rotors, etc. were outrageous for duallys...after research, they actually aren't...yeah brakes are a bit more, but not crazy...not even the rotors..I found them from $40-100 a piece.

I'm leaning more towards CTD currently. Maybe not this dually, I'm still going back and forth with it, but definitely something in 2nd gen. How often do 3rd gen's have the injector issues anyways?

 

yes, depends on what generation of cummins we are talking about...3rd gen and 4th gen cummins are ridiculous for injector costs (common rail injected) as those cost over a grand...

BUT! second gen 24v injectors (gen he was asking about) are cheap! you can get a full set of 6 aftermarket +50hp injectors for $300 and stock injectors will last a lot longer than you think on a cummins...I changed to aftermarket because I wanted more power at over 200k but those stock injectors lasted 200k miles with zero issues.

and turbo....my stock turbo lasted well over 200k miles before i blew it up with performance adders...had I not done power adders it would still be on the truck chuggin along as stock or mild power does not use the stock turbo to its full potential..they really only spin it to 1/2 its potential boost that is still within its efficiency map. 35psi is max boost while still in turbo map...higher is out of the map. stock you only get like 16psi out of it..

as for cost: well I can get an aftermarket turbo for $1100, or I can get a stock for about 1/2 that, and that stock turbo and stock injectors will last longer on the cummins than the hemi engine will before it needs rebuild...so really which is more cost effective here??! it costs more to rebuild a hemi than it does to rebuild/replace turbo and injectors...now the injection pump might go out at 200k on cummins, thats a $1000 replacement every 200k or so, but I've seen people with 300k+ on stock turbos and injectors with no issues. the reason most of us change those is a quest for more power, not because they went bad or wore out...

also if in the event an injector leaks or pop pressure becomes off...send it off to one of the injector builders that post on cumminsforum, they will inspect and fix them all for like $50

so again: I'm still not seeing where you get this myth that maintenance and repairs cost so much more on a cummins than on a gas engine...

 

Stearing componats, suspension componats, drive line componats, ie upper and lower ball joints, tie rods, drag link, pit man arm, wheel bearing hubs, front U joints, drive shaft u joints are also items that get costly over and above a 1500 Ram if a need to repair hits you.