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ASD Relay removed, but has voltage on #87 when "on"?

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Old Jan 19, 2016 | 12:57 AM
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Question ASD Relay removed, but has voltage on #87 when "on"?


I have searched and searched and remain stumped. Forums, FSM, Google.

95 Dakota SLT, 3.9l 4x4 auto. 265,xxx miles.

Background: Random stalls, driving or sitting. then no starts. Has fuel pressure, no spark. Randomly starts back up.

Checked the infamous splices and resoldered any way just to be safe.

No check engine light ever, at all, period, during this issue. When truck is running light comes on as normal in power up cycle, then goes away.
PCM has power from battery.
ASD relay has power at 30 and 85 (when key on)
Crank sensor passed service manual tests
Cam sensor passed service manual tests
Pulled off every ground wire I could locate and cleaned them all off with a wire brush and replaced them.
Plugs, wires, cap, rotor, all great shape.
Brand new coil due to being naive.
Checked distributor gear wasn't broken.


IMPORTANT: Checked voltage on connector at coil. Green/orange stipe wire has 4.5-5.5 volts. Rarely, but never more than 8 volts.
Not 12.45v like the battery. This is cranking engine and sitting in "on" position.

Ran a jumper wire from 30 to 87 in the PDC for the ASD Relay despite fully tested and operating relay. -still no start

Ran a jumper wire from relay block directly to the coil to verify 12v. -still no start.

What I don't fully understand is this. In the PDC, with the relay removed from the ASD slot, and the key in the "on" position, I have 4.5-5.5 volts in the #87 plug for the relay, fluctuating erradically. This is the same voltage I noted is arriving at the coil, in the same erratic manner. But, if the ASD relay supplies the power to that plug, and yet it is unplugged, is there supposed to be any power at this point?

I slipped a wire in with the relay to connect my meter to and despite everything being in operating condition per spec, it still reads 4.5-5.5 v.
I know the computer controls the ground for all the engine electrical stuff, but it doesn't make sense that you put 12v on a circuit and get 1/3rd of that as a result. Also, I did tighten up the prongs in the pdc to ensure it was making good contact. Is this normal?

I've read the posts of people replacing part after part to no avail, so I'm trying to be as thorough as possible before doing the same. Surely, I'm not the first to stick a probe in this plug, so somebody must know
 

Last edited by TragicTemper; Jan 19, 2016 at 01:00 AM.
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Old Jan 19, 2016 | 08:36 AM
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Well, there's the ECU feed to the coil - if that's leaking inside the ECU, you'd have some voltage feed to the coil, which would then feed through to the ASD.

I'd disconnect the coil (either side of the low voltage, don't need to touch the high voltage wire) and see if that voltage goes away.

And I'd also check under the PDC for possible corrosion and leakage from a previous bad battery.

RwP
 
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Old Jan 19, 2016 | 05:00 PM
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Well, it's running after a few different repairs.
I started by pulling the pcm and opened it up. There are a few cracks in the sealant which had me worried, but with a flashlight, I was able to see through the "goo" and all the circuitry appeared to be in good shape, nothing noticeably damaged.
Next I looked closer at the prongs for the 60 way plug. They didn't look the cleanest, so I took a square x-acto knife blade and gently ran it up and down the prongs to scrape any residue off the prongs. I then carefully wiggled the blade into the tip of each prong to spread them all out just a tiny little bit, as I noticed some had a gap and others didn't.

So now, the prongs were all cleaned and should be making better contact to the connector. She started right up, my check engine light is back to working order. And then she suddenly died after about a minute. A short lived victory.

To my surprise, when I turned the key back to the 'on' position I expected the check engine light to either be gone again, or really dim as it had been in the past. But there it was, bright as could be! So I tried to start it again. And she fired right up.
So now that she's finally running, I could do the "wiggle" test on the rest of the wiring harness. I had already done this to an extent, but didn't do the stretch that runs in front of the intake manifold.

A loud pop was heard and the engine died. And then, for some odd reason my cruise control solenoid started clicking quite loudly. I had heard it before in my tests, but was unable to locate the noise. So I pulled everything off the engine I needed to, to get the wires out and un wrapped. With them all exposed I started it up again and carefully started wiggling each wire independently from each other.

The culprit was one of the two solenoid wires for the alternator. The green wire to be exact. I could kill and catch the engine from dying by carefully twisting the wire. These two wires have a very thick coating over a rather thin wire, I'm guessing to keep any interference between the wires. I spliced in a new wire on both, and covered each with a layer of shrink tubing and then electrical tape to try and keep them from interfering with the other wires.

I am still cautious about traveling too far from home, as I fear there may be some other gremlins still at work, but I was able to run into town and grab some food which would have been otherwise impossible without sitting on the side of the road for 15 minutes at least once. A side note, my tach used to bounce around erratically, and this started long before my no start issues, but today it seems to be fixed. I'm guessing from cleaning up the connector to the pcm.

Thanks for the reply RalphP. I double checked the coil and the pdc and couldn't figure it out. Now that I think about it, I'll go out and check it later now that it's running again and see if the voltages are the same as before.
 
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Old Jul 10, 2024 | 04:37 AM
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Default Same issue different mopar

Issue on a 99 Durango....it cranks no start ... replacement of all sensors and coils relays and fuses ....upon checking pin 87 with the relay installed (asd) it is fluctuating voltage from 9 volts to 10 or 11 out of the relay ... different relays do not help I have a solid 12.6 at two connections one all the time one with key on but I'm only receiving low voltage out of the relay ...why is this ....I get the amsane fluctuating voltage at the coil ... ground tests good at the relay using test light ...it tests good at the pcm plug as well ...it sputters like it's going to start and then nothing...it's fouling out plugs constantly and sounds like it's out of time but is in fact on number one at TDC new everything even injectors .....could a transmission plug or relay cause this no start or a alternator issue ? I'm getting solid voltage at large wire on alternator I don't know what else to do ....I have many Mopar all 5.9 and I've never had this issue ever ....even reset the security feature......no check engine light ....all gauges work and fuel pump has 50 psi at valve ...tested injector pulse and it's the same irratic voltage please help 7316020868
 
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Old Jul 10, 2024 | 06:51 AM
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You should post in the Durango section. Check what voltage you have going into the ASD relay(86). If it's still wonky you will have to back track to see where the issues is.
 
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