new owner, with a few problems.
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Registered User
Joined: Nov 2019
Posts: 4
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From: Toledo
new owner, with a few problems.
ok so quick back story: i know very little about any specifics, but i know how stuff works in general so i am a quick learner, however, i have only ever changed tires, oil and brake lights before this car.
in the spring ('19) i traded in my '10 Ford fusion for a '17 fusion, (cert. pre-owned) my last fusion started to need work as soon as the base warranty was up so this time, i got the extended and opted out of the gap, which obviously i didn't use before. well 2 days after my first payment, someone pulled out in front of me and totaled it, I still owe money.
the car: so i meet this guy he's moving in with his girl they just had a kid. he can't bring a car which isn't running there and doesn't have the extra money or time to fix it. says he is scraping it or selling for 400, but it needs to be gone tomorrow. so i bought it then and there.
he tells me it's a 97 highline has a racing computer, Indy intake, newer engine& tranny swap, cold air intake, custom throttle body
the issues: well a bunch of people said they'd help me, but none have made it over yet, been a few weeks, it's been getting darker and colder earlier and i have no electricity in this garage.
so they put an 03 2.0 sohc engine in the 97 body. swapped the wire harness, transmission (so its auto) and gave me a different computer (ngc) to install.
so i have read that moding an ngc is less effective as with the original pmc unless i get a megasquirt (is this still the best method? anything cheaper? do i need stage 1 and 2 chips on top of the ms?). guy said it has a plug and play racing computer but when i looked it up, it came up as stock. is it likely that someone remapped it?
first problem has just been figured out, he said the Indy intake manifold was going on it. a majority of these weeks was waiting on AutoZone to get my feldpar mani gasket in, turns out they never put the order in, so i just got that from rockauto today. went to put it on and the plugs didn't seem right. turns out that's one that fits the 1st gen dohc, so i took the original manifold off and waited weeks for nothing. (so if anyone wants this new 1st gen Indy intake, I'll come off the 500$ part for cheap) also, the base where the bolts hold the manifold to the engine was originally thicker in a few areas so in trying to get the bolt in all the way, it snapped... i there is a decent amount sticking out and i can remove the manifold and put the other on, this Indy still seems tight. any suggestions? what's the easiest way to clean out the original before putting it back on? what are some after market intakes which aren't too pricey that i can replace it with and get decent gains? i am researching putting an 05 srt4 turbofold on by putting dohc headers on the sohc block and upgrading the cam to a comp400 and trying to get the compression increased from the loss taken in switching the head, will probably upgrade exhaust mani to a longer rod at some point too, but i was wondering if there were any other good options for intake manifold upgrades and possible turbo kits for them as well.
so next i was wondering, it came with a new custom 75mm throttle body which fit the 1st Gen Indy intake and chrome intake pipes to attach. is this too big? is there going to be any issues putting such a large tb on the stock intake; before i swap the old intake back on and run into issues attaching this... also, what size are the tb bolts and where would i get them? (i can't find anything that fits, all the bolts were thrown in the trunk, it came with all the new parts and most of the old parts but i couldn't find the old tb and bolts, some bolts seemed to fit but were too long).
any other suggestions to give this car the gains the previous owners hoped for?
in the spring ('19) i traded in my '10 Ford fusion for a '17 fusion, (cert. pre-owned) my last fusion started to need work as soon as the base warranty was up so this time, i got the extended and opted out of the gap, which obviously i didn't use before. well 2 days after my first payment, someone pulled out in front of me and totaled it, I still owe money.
the car: so i meet this guy he's moving in with his girl they just had a kid. he can't bring a car which isn't running there and doesn't have the extra money or time to fix it. says he is scraping it or selling for 400, but it needs to be gone tomorrow. so i bought it then and there.
he tells me it's a 97 highline has a racing computer, Indy intake, newer engine& tranny swap, cold air intake, custom throttle body
the issues: well a bunch of people said they'd help me, but none have made it over yet, been a few weeks, it's been getting darker and colder earlier and i have no electricity in this garage.
so they put an 03 2.0 sohc engine in the 97 body. swapped the wire harness, transmission (so its auto) and gave me a different computer (ngc) to install.
so i have read that moding an ngc is less effective as with the original pmc unless i get a megasquirt (is this still the best method? anything cheaper? do i need stage 1 and 2 chips on top of the ms?). guy said it has a plug and play racing computer but when i looked it up, it came up as stock. is it likely that someone remapped it?
first problem has just been figured out, he said the Indy intake manifold was going on it. a majority of these weeks was waiting on AutoZone to get my feldpar mani gasket in, turns out they never put the order in, so i just got that from rockauto today. went to put it on and the plugs didn't seem right. turns out that's one that fits the 1st gen dohc, so i took the original manifold off and waited weeks for nothing. (so if anyone wants this new 1st gen Indy intake, I'll come off the 500$ part for cheap) also, the base where the bolts hold the manifold to the engine was originally thicker in a few areas so in trying to get the bolt in all the way, it snapped... i there is a decent amount sticking out and i can remove the manifold and put the other on, this Indy still seems tight. any suggestions? what's the easiest way to clean out the original before putting it back on? what are some after market intakes which aren't too pricey that i can replace it with and get decent gains? i am researching putting an 05 srt4 turbofold on by putting dohc headers on the sohc block and upgrading the cam to a comp400 and trying to get the compression increased from the loss taken in switching the head, will probably upgrade exhaust mani to a longer rod at some point too, but i was wondering if there were any other good options for intake manifold upgrades and possible turbo kits for them as well.
so next i was wondering, it came with a new custom 75mm throttle body which fit the 1st Gen Indy intake and chrome intake pipes to attach. is this too big? is there going to be any issues putting such a large tb on the stock intake; before i swap the old intake back on and run into issues attaching this... also, what size are the tb bolts and where would i get them? (i can't find anything that fits, all the bolts were thrown in the trunk, it came with all the new parts and most of the old parts but i couldn't find the old tb and bolts, some bolts seemed to fit but were too long).
any other suggestions to give this car the gains the previous owners hoped for?
Last edited by Trent U; Nov 21, 2019 at 11:47 PM.
Captain
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 529
Likes: 18
From: SW Va
Welcome to the 2nd Gen Neon forum.
I see you don't have any replies yet, so I'll see if I can get things started.
You sure seem able & willing to jump in over your head from the get-go & no way are your problems likely to be unraveled here in a few posts. All that said, with your inexperience, why not consider getting the Stock set up working properly, to sorta learn the ropes, while doing some research on the mods you want to make & the Best order in which to do them & maybe you would be more likely to come to a more acceptable ending, without so many unknowns confusing & corrupting things along the way. Some beginning thoughts for consideration.
I see you don't have any replies yet, so I'll see if I can get things started.
You sure seem able & willing to jump in over your head from the get-go & no way are your problems likely to be unraveled here in a few posts. All that said, with your inexperience, why not consider getting the Stock set up working properly, to sorta learn the ropes, while doing some research on the mods you want to make & the Best order in which to do them & maybe you would be more likely to come to a more acceptable ending, without so many unknowns confusing & corrupting things along the way. Some beginning thoughts for consideration.
Thread Starter
|
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2019
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: Toledo
Welcome to the 2nd Gen Neon forum.
I see you don't have any replies yet, so I'll see if I can get things started.
You sure seem able & willing to jump in over your head from the get-go & no way are your problems likely to be unraveled here in a few posts. All that said, with your inexperience, why not consider getting the Stock set up working properly, to sorta learn the ropes, while doing some research on the mods you want to make & the Best order in which to do them & maybe you would be more likely to come to a more acceptable ending, without so many unknowns confusing & corrupting things along the way. Some beginning thoughts for consideration.
I see you don't have any replies yet, so I'll see if I can get things started.
You sure seem able & willing to jump in over your head from the get-go & no way are your problems likely to be unraveled here in a few posts. All that said, with your inexperience, why not consider getting the Stock set up working properly, to sorta learn the ropes, while doing some research on the mods you want to make & the Best order in which to do them & maybe you would be more likely to come to a more acceptable ending, without so many unknowns confusing & corrupting things along the way. Some beginning thoughts for consideration.
so with stock set-up.
03 air filter housing is where the 97 battery mount is.
tried using battery mount and bending the hose between 03 manifold and throttle body 90 degrees up to mimic the 97 manifold waterneck, losing the filter housing and trying to use the cold air intake piping. so far having difficulties, i think the TB is to high not leaving enough room for the intake pipes to lead behind the engine. plus the sensor plugs aren't reaching well, and one doesn't seem like the right plug.
as far as the plugs, there are a few which i can't tell where they plug in, if they are extra because it's the 03 harness, if i just don't see where they plug in. there are a few that seem like they should go in one place but don't fit, weird if its 03 engine and 03 harness, why does this part in the engine plug in fine but the one right next to it doesn't (like the two sensors on the 03 TB, only one has a fit, if the other plugs into a sensor on the other harness, can i just cut that plug of and splice one that fits?).
will the computer run right without some of plugs hooked up? i have the other harness too, all cut up up with missing sensors and the one on the engine looks patched up everywhere so I'm thinking they were doing wire splicing.
i have pictures of everything that seems off
as for the air intake, if bending it up doesn't work, I'll have to probably move my battery to the trunk and use the air housing. or get that Indy intake manifold and throttle body modified by someone local
Thread Starter
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Registered User
Joined: Nov 2019
Posts: 4
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From: Toledo
went stock
thank you. i did end up going back to stock, as i researched what i had to do to get the parts they wanted on. i'll end up having to get the waterneck cut off the intake manifold, TB bolting mount welded back on. sensors swapped out of manifold and throttle body (tb needs a bit of modification for the bolt pattern not lining up) decently easy if i had the tools needed.
so with stock set-up.
03 air filter housing is where the 97 battery mount is.
tried using battery mount and bending the hose between 03 manifold and throttle body 90 degrees up to mimic the 97 manifold waterneck, losing the filter housing and trying to use the cold air intake piping. so far having difficulties, i think the TB is to high not leaving enough room for the intake pipes to lead behind the engine. plus the sensor plugs aren't reaching well, and one doesn't seem like the right plug.
as far as the plugs, there are a few which i can't tell where they plug in, if they are extra because it's the 03 harness, if i just don't see where they plug in. there are a few that seem like they should go in one place but don't fit, weird if its 03 engine and 03 harness, why does this part in the engine plug in fine but the one right next to it doesn't (like the two sensors on the 03 TB, only one has a fit, if the other plugs into a sensor on the other harness, can i just cut that plug of and splice one that fits?).
will the computer run right without some of plugs hooked up? i have the other harness too, all cut up up with missing sensors and the one on the engine looks patched up everywhere so I'm thinking they were doing wire splicing.
i have pictures of everything that seems off
as for the air intake, if bending it up doesn't work, I'll have to probably move my battery to the trunk and use the air housing. or get that Indy intake manifold and throttle body modified by someone local
so with stock set-up.
03 air filter housing is where the 97 battery mount is.
tried using battery mount and bending the hose between 03 manifold and throttle body 90 degrees up to mimic the 97 manifold waterneck, losing the filter housing and trying to use the cold air intake piping. so far having difficulties, i think the TB is to high not leaving enough room for the intake pipes to lead behind the engine. plus the sensor plugs aren't reaching well, and one doesn't seem like the right plug.
as far as the plugs, there are a few which i can't tell where they plug in, if they are extra because it's the 03 harness, if i just don't see where they plug in. there are a few that seem like they should go in one place but don't fit, weird if its 03 engine and 03 harness, why does this part in the engine plug in fine but the one right next to it doesn't (like the two sensors on the 03 TB, only one has a fit, if the other plugs into a sensor on the other harness, can i just cut that plug of and splice one that fits?).
will the computer run right without some of plugs hooked up? i have the other harness too, all cut up up with missing sensors and the one on the engine looks patched up everywhere so I'm thinking they were doing wire splicing.
i have pictures of everything that seems off
as for the air intake, if bending it up doesn't work, I'll have to probably move my battery to the trunk and use the air housing. or get that Indy intake manifold and throttle body modified by someone local
Thread Starter
|
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2019
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: Toledo
Welcome to the 2nd Gen Neon forum.
I see you don't have any replies yet, so I'll see if I can get things started.
You sure seem able & willing to jump in over your head from the get-go & no way are your problems likely to be unraveled here in a few posts. All that said, with your inexperience, why not consider getting the Stock set up working properly, to sorta learn the ropes, while doing some research on the mods you want to make & the Best order in which to do them & maybe you would be more likely to come to a more acceptable ending, without so many unknowns confusing & corrupting things along the way. Some beginning thoughts for consideration.
I see you don't have any replies yet, so I'll see if I can get things started.
You sure seem able & willing to jump in over your head from the get-go & no way are your problems likely to be unraveled here in a few posts. All that said, with your inexperience, why not consider getting the Stock set up working properly, to sorta learn the ropes, while doing some research on the mods you want to make & the Best order in which to do them & maybe you would be more likely to come to a more acceptable ending, without so many unknowns confusing & corrupting things along the way. Some beginning thoughts for consideration.
first, i have a few connectors on the wire harness which do not fit the sensors. now I'm not sure if it's a 97 harness (which would make sense so they didn't have to integrate the 03 engine harness into the 97 body harness right?) with some of the 03 connectors already switched, and I'll find the 03 connectors on the other wire harness i have? otherwise i don't see why only one of the two 03 throttle body sensors works with the current connectors and also the intake mani connector works fine... and half the connectors fit the sensors on the head and block. the sensor in the exhaust manifold wasnt fitting the connector but i found another sensor which looked like the tip of a grill lighter and that fit right in the connector so i guess I'll just swap the sensor.
which brings me to my next question. if I try to swap in a connector from the other harness to a sensor on the engine which fits, but the wires don't match up right, can i go to the junk yard and pull the right sensor to fit the connector on the harness, can i just swap those sensors out?
and there are a couple of connectors which i can't find sensors to connect to... are these most likely just parts which this new set up doesn't use? i am near sure i have everything in there under the hood, no more parts to bolt in. so, can i just leave those hanging, then when i have all the sensors, which i do see but currently don't fit on the harness, actually hooked up, i just fill up all the engine fluids then connect the battery, and see first, if it turns over, and if it does, see if it any warning lights come on and get the codes read, right?
also, the other big issue is, the 97 battery mount for the body of the car is in the same place as the 03 engines air filter housing. so, 97 intake mani has a waterneck which mounts the TB facing up, air filter behind the engine, 03 TB mounts to the air filter housing facing the and driver fender and has a bendy tube to the intake.
right now i tried to use the battery mount and then use the bendy tube to mimic the water neck, facing the TB up, then attach the metal intake pipes they gave me to them, however it seems that this set up takes the TB way higher and the intake pipes to the air filter won't fit to around the back of the engine right.
seems I'll have to use the 03 air filter and route the battery to the trunk.
however i found someone who will let me use their grinder to take off the 97 indy intake's waterneck, and move the mounting base from the top of the waterneck to the new hole at the bottom of the manifold by using the best jb weld type stuff i can find to attach it (think it'll be strong enough to mount the TB to?), it already has the bolt pattern redrilled where the mani bolts to the head, looks like the head is ported sightly bigger than the valves on the Indy mani, so that should be fine right? they are shaped different but i have a gasket that works with the combo. then i can just switch the 03 manifold sensor into the refabed 97 manifold right? then i won't need to move the battery to the back, seems like more work than making the after market parts fit right if i have the access to the tools now.
which sounds like the best plan for getting things to fit? refab the 97 intake or move battery to the trunk? i might just buy another car tomorrow which does run lmao so i can take more time on this car and not be as worried about getting it running asap so i can do the best possible option, i still have to finish the interior any way.
although i may also have someone on stand by with a 97 sohc stock intake and tb which might fit better but i think still has the waterneck, which with the 97 Indy mani and custom tb, it doesn't quite fit with the waterneck, not sure if stock set up will fit better.
lots of options and sightly confusing for someone new to all this!
i actually tried to reply a few days ago, guess my phone didn't post it.
Captain
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 529
Likes: 18
From: SW Va
We have access to the FSM's here https://dodgeforum.com/forum/2nd-gen...ml#post2459990. Click on the Red year span that fits your vehicle. Be sure to be logged into your Google account & be logged in here before clicking the link & they should open. All kinds of helpful info there for your situation.