430 hp with just bolt ons
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Champion
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430 hp with just bolt ons
I was walkin down the aisle in the grocery store tonight and an article title caught my eye in master engine builders mag or something. Get 430 horse out of your mopar magnum. They talked about the diffrences in the magnum and LA class motors, and this and that. They then went into the modifying of one of the mopar magnum 300 horse replacement blocks. They said the mopar 300 horse block was just your average 5.9 magnum truck motor with a dual plane intake and a carb setup as opposed to an efi system. They started with LT headers giving them 7 more torque and 12 more horse. Then realised that the dual plane was the next place for improvement, and switched the the M1 4bbl and gainedapprox. 20 horse (from what memory recalls, i bought the mag but its downstairs. ill get the actual numbers later). Then they switched to a edelbrock air gap performer rpm, and gained down low torque but lost it up top in compairison to the m1. with the m1 back in place they swapped the heads and cam. the edelbrock 2.02 heads were the heads of choice, and the cam was i believe a comp cam X series cam custom ground (they included the specs but i forget them). And got 430 horse 430 torque with the m1. Switching back to the air gap brought the horse down, and the torque up again. It was very intreguing, and sounded extreemly familear to the "lightning killer" package that i found earlier in the month. My main question is, does the switching to carb really wake up these motors 50 horse?
Captain
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 504
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From: Spokane WA
RE: 430 hp with just bolt ons
.....i had an instructor in school (wyotech) that was rated as one of the top ten engine builders. Chuck (charlie) Sikes. He said the only good thing carbs are good for is a door holder. Efi is so much better becuase it is more flexable. You can set the air fuel ration for each rpm and each condition..depending on the program you have or the program the "flasher" has. With a carb you have to rely on your knowledge of jetting the carb correctly. Becuase you can control efi so much better then a carb you have the ability to gain more horsepower with efi if it's tuned correctly.
Champion
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,313
Likes: 8
RE: 430 hp with just bolt ons
I am guessing you are refering to Steve Dulcich's article
in Spring 2007 EngineMasters magazine pages 58-67 about his mod testing on Mopar Performance crate 5.9V8
It is a very good article well worth reading.
Buy the magazine for your collection (and to keep Dulcich in a job).
However, it is completely wrong to think
that article in anyway claims
that using a carburetor is superior
to a properly adjusted fuel injection MPI system.
Steve Dulcich is not saying that, or that carbs are better, or even simpler.
The next step in a 'build up' project like Dulcich does on the MP crate 360 V8 would be to put an aftermarket EFI system on. That would improve fuel distribution, raise hp and torque both at high and low rpms, and perhaps allow even more compression ratio to be used on the 'worst' of the eight cylinders.
Dulcich is one of the best of the magazine article writers.
Look at his article on the 5.7 crate engine:
http://www.popularhotrodding.com/eng.../0602phr_hemi/
also check out his intake modding:
http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/t...kes/index.html
CAI guys be sure to read to the end of the moparmusclemagazine article and check out the photo where a few experiments were done 'tuning' the volume of the intake plenum with extension tubes, then ask yourself
'Do the aftermarket CAI makers know what their volume changes do?'
I can't speak for KN, Volant, Airaid, Aircharger, etc
but I know for certain Air_Ram can't calculate what volume changes to the plenums of the intakes do to the torque curve.
One important thing about Steve Dulcich is that his 'rep' is good enough that he and Richard Holdener could place a telephone call to Dodge engineering and get replies about what plenum volume changes would be expected to do. You and I could not get Dodge to talk to us about that.
Dulcich also did a great article on the Magnum 318 build up several years ago that is online:
http://www.carcraft.com/howto/116_0401_318/index.html
hopefully this recent Magnum 5.9V8 article will be put online in the future.
in Spring 2007 EngineMasters magazine pages 58-67 about his mod testing on Mopar Performance crate 5.9V8
It is a very good article well worth reading.
Buy the magazine for your collection (and to keep Dulcich in a job).
However, it is completely wrong to think
that article in anyway claims
that using a carburetor is superior
to a properly adjusted fuel injection MPI system.
Steve Dulcich is not saying that, or that carbs are better, or even simpler.
The next step in a 'build up' project like Dulcich does on the MP crate 360 V8 would be to put an aftermarket EFI system on. That would improve fuel distribution, raise hp and torque both at high and low rpms, and perhaps allow even more compression ratio to be used on the 'worst' of the eight cylinders.
Dulcich is one of the best of the magazine article writers.
Look at his article on the 5.7 crate engine:
http://www.popularhotrodding.com/eng.../0602phr_hemi/
also check out his intake modding:
http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/t...kes/index.html
CAI guys be sure to read to the end of the moparmusclemagazine article and check out the photo where a few experiments were done 'tuning' the volume of the intake plenum with extension tubes, then ask yourself
'Do the aftermarket CAI makers know what their volume changes do?'
I can't speak for KN, Volant, Airaid, Aircharger, etc
but I know for certain Air_Ram can't calculate what volume changes to the plenums of the intakes do to the torque curve.
One important thing about Steve Dulcich is that his 'rep' is good enough that he and Richard Holdener could place a telephone call to Dodge engineering and get replies about what plenum volume changes would be expected to do. You and I could not get Dodge to talk to us about that.
Dulcich also did a great article on the Magnum 318 build up several years ago that is online:
http://www.carcraft.com/howto/116_0401_318/index.html
hopefully this recent Magnum 5.9V8 article will be put online in the future.
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Champion
Joined: Nov 2006
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From:
RE: 430 hp with just bolt ons
ORIGINAL: HankL
I am guessing you are refering to Steve Dulcich's article
in Spring 2007 EngineMasters magazine pages 58-67 about his mod testing on Mopar Performance crate 5.9V8
It is a very good article well worth reading.
Buy the magazine for your collection (and to keep Dulcich in a job).
However, it is completely wrong to think
that article in anyway claims
that using a carburetor is superior
to a properly adjusted fuel injection MPI system.
Steve Dulcich is not saying that, or that carbs are better, or even simpler.
The next step in a 'build up' project like Dulcich does on the MP crate 360 V8 would be to put an aftermarket EFI system on. That would improve fuel distribution, raise hp and torque both at high and low rpms, and perhaps allow even more compression ratio to be used on the 'worst' of the eight cylinders.
Dulcich is one of the best of the magazine article writers.
Look at his article on the 5.7 crate engine:
http://www.popularhotrodding.com/eng.../0602phr_hemi/
also check out his intake modding:
http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/t...kes/index.html
CAI guys be sure to read to the end of the moparmusclemagazine article and check out the photo where a few experiments were done 'tuning' the volume of the intake plenum with extension tubes, then ask yourself
'Do the aftermarket CAI makers know what their volume changes do?'
I can't speak for KN, Volant, Airaid, Aircharger, etc
but I know for certain Air_Ram can't calculate what volume changes to the plenums of the intakes do to the torque curve.
One important thing about Steve Dulcich is that his 'rep' is good enough that he and Richard Holdener could place a telephone call to Dodge engineering and get replies about what plenum volume changes would be expected to do. You and I could not get Dodge to talk to us about that.
Dulcich also did a great article on the Magnum 318 build up several years ago that is online:
http://www.carcraft.com/howto/116_0401_318/index.html
hopefully this recent Magnum 5.9V8 article will be put online in the future.
I am guessing you are refering to Steve Dulcich's article
in Spring 2007 EngineMasters magazine pages 58-67 about his mod testing on Mopar Performance crate 5.9V8
It is a very good article well worth reading.
Buy the magazine for your collection (and to keep Dulcich in a job).
However, it is completely wrong to think
that article in anyway claims
that using a carburetor is superior
to a properly adjusted fuel injection MPI system.
Steve Dulcich is not saying that, or that carbs are better, or even simpler.
The next step in a 'build up' project like Dulcich does on the MP crate 360 V8 would be to put an aftermarket EFI system on. That would improve fuel distribution, raise hp and torque both at high and low rpms, and perhaps allow even more compression ratio to be used on the 'worst' of the eight cylinders.
Dulcich is one of the best of the magazine article writers.
Look at his article on the 5.7 crate engine:
http://www.popularhotrodding.com/eng.../0602phr_hemi/
also check out his intake modding:
http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/t...kes/index.html
CAI guys be sure to read to the end of the moparmusclemagazine article and check out the photo where a few experiments were done 'tuning' the volume of the intake plenum with extension tubes, then ask yourself
'Do the aftermarket CAI makers know what their volume changes do?'
I can't speak for KN, Volant, Airaid, Aircharger, etc
but I know for certain Air_Ram can't calculate what volume changes to the plenums of the intakes do to the torque curve.
One important thing about Steve Dulcich is that his 'rep' is good enough that he and Richard Holdener could place a telephone call to Dodge engineering and get replies about what plenum volume changes would be expected to do. You and I could not get Dodge to talk to us about that.
Dulcich also did a great article on the Magnum 318 build up several years ago that is online:
http://www.carcraft.com/howto/116_0401_318/index.html
hopefully this recent Magnum 5.9V8 article will be put online in the future.
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 34
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RE: 430 hp with just bolt ons
Something that will trip you out is if you look at the Mopar performance parts catalog at their crate engines. Some of them are rated carb output and efi output. The carb output for hp is either better than, or equal to efi. However, the tq is either equal to or better than carb. It's gotta be the intake manifolds, cause everything else is the same.
