horatio102

What am I supposed to get from the recall #'s? What I see is company that cares enough about the cars they sell to correct a problem. Personally, That's the company I'd like to deal with.

Statisics can be misleading, especially ones based on customer opinions.

The thing that gets Honda so far down the road is the maintenance schedule for the car. If you followed the maintenance recommendations of the Honda on a Neon, you'd be surprised how well the Neon would do in comparision.

 

Guido - fair enough. I bought what I wanted as well. More or less. I really wanted a 91-93 cummins, but I couldn't find one in the area for under 10k when I got mine, so I got an older gasser instead. And I love it.

vfs - you don't even know. I'm reading what I want? ha. That comment you quoted was in response to the guys who say they'll only ever buy american - but there isn't one manufacturer whose money goes nowhere but here.

Instead of comparing neon to civic I had to bring the Breeze into it? HA. Don't you know it's the same car? Take away the 19 recalls it contributed and the Neon STILL had more than the Civic. I think it's YOU who is trying to make the numbers read in your favor.

Yeah, Chrysler makes more cars. They have more divisions. Perhaps they've spread themselves too thin to keep quality under control, as evidenced by the 750 recalls over the last ten years. How am I losing this arguement? All I stated was that Japanese cars are on average more reliable with fewer problems and better quality than their American counterparts. You have yet to show me or anyone else that I'm incorrect.

You love your Dodge, great. You want to buy a car that's made here by our workers... great. Subaru makes a lot of vehicles here. So do Toyota and Honda. Do any of them make cars in Mexico? I don't think so. QC Rams are made in Mexico. So was my Jetta, which you seem to think I love and sing nothing but praises for since you obviously don't read what I type. Yeah, if the quality control was there the Jetta would be a great car. But instead I get inferior parts that fail. But the warranty is good and the dealer is cooperative.

You would hazard a guess that 75% of the members here love their Dodges and wouldn't trade them for a Ford or VW. Good for you and good for them. I'm one of those people. I wouldn't trade my truck for anything but a newer Dodge diesel. If and when I feel like making a car payment I may just get one. You seem to think that I hate Dodge and everything they make. Perhaps it's because that's what you want to read. It's not true, I love my dodge, even though it breaks and stuff fails. I'll have you know that I do the regular maint on it and the reason things are wearing out is that it's got 250k miles on everything but the stuff I've replaced. If I had a Toyota I'd be replacing stuff on it all the time too. I personally think Dodge makes the best trucks out there all things considered. But I know that the offerings from some of the Japanese makes are built to stricter standards which results in higher quality and better reliability.

I like how you summarily dismissed my entire post in one paragraph. You don't like the results therefore it's not a valid comparison. Odyssey vs Caravan: 25 to 63. Ok, let's compare it ONLY to Plymouth Grand Voyager. honda = 25, plymouth = 25. You like that better, right? It's the Chrysler minivan with the fewest recalls and it's dead even with the odyssey. Oh, but the plymouth was discontinued a while ago, so it's got fewer years to compare. You fail to prove that the Japanese vehicles have worse reliability or quality. Yeah, DC sells a lot more minivans than Honda, but if their suppliers can't give them quality parts in a sufficient quantity, shouldn't they cut back on production until they get something that'll last? Nope, just sell them the junk and replace it if they have a problem - that's Detroit's answer.

Again let me state it in plain english one more time for the short bus crowd - I love my dodge, but Japanese quality and reliability is unsurpassed.

 

I think I touched on this in the last paragraph or so but I'll recap: Manufacturer can't get a high quality part in sufficient quantity so they go with the cheapo part and figure they'll fix it later if it breaks.

VW did this with the ignition coils.

I'd rather do business with the company that takes the time to verify it's parts and systems before selling it to me. Yeah DC and VW are great about taking care of their customers when they come in with problems, but I'd rather not have to go to the dealer with a problem.

My Honda, never went to the dealer. Mom's Honda only had 2 problems - ignition cylinder would get a little sticky so you had to smack it before it would realize the key was out (no keyless if the key is in) and a dogbone motor mount thing wore a little bit - made a slight clunk but wasn't an issue of concern. Sister's Honda hasn't had a problem yet, and she's not exactly on top of maint.

My first Subaru had problems related to that time when I drove over a 3 month old cow doing 50mph, but that was it. Second Subaru had the wrong oil in the gearbox from the factory. Third Subaru didn't have any real problems, just a couple of bulbs that burned out in dash switches.

The guys at the Jeep/Dodge dealer knew me by name because I was in there so often with problems. I'd rather spend my time elsewhere. That's what shows the quality of a product to me. How much time do I have to spend getting the thing fixed, recall or not. And by FAR the Japanese cars I've owned have all been way more reliable.

 

Well in all fairness of the nine MoPars I've owned, only the 01 Neon and Dakota were the only ones I ever had that gave me any problems. The minor problems were also corrected. I do have the benefit of growing up with a mechanic as a father. I got too see at least a little bit of everything and alot of somethings (GM products). He still tells me about how the Pennsylvania roads and winters just destroy the Jap cars. I really believe that many people have been persauded into thinking that the Japanese cars are far superior to what is offered be DC, Ford, or GM. That may have been true back 20 years ago, but the gap is considerably closer now.

Over the years Honda has built a reputation on reliable, but very bland vehicles. If you don't ask much of the machine, or push them, you don't have to worry about them since you aren't stressing them. Combining that with the rigorous maintainenance schedule required by the manufacturer and you have a car capable of going down the road.

Another thing about general recalls. There is no requirement that says the manufacturer has to recall anything. Just because those numbers are low doesn't mean that the parts are any better.

 

woah. . .there be some long posts in here[X(]

 

Let me see if I misread your post - The paragraph I was referring to says:

No reference to WWII, Koreans, Vietnam. If I remember my rules of grammar correctly, each paragraph is to be considered its own thought. Accordingly I did not misread your post, you simply did not post what you wanted to. Obviously there is no sin in that, however, in the future you should not point fingers at others when it would be better to admit our own mistakes. I admit mine all the time.

Speaking to the point of your post; however, "car guys" have always been irrational. I will not consider a Ford or Chevy (and what is more American than Chevy right?) So “buy American� is no more bigoted than “don’t buy Chevy�. And even if it was, it is certainly no more bigoted that rooting for your country in the Olympics right?


By the way, I can't resist. You in one post in this thread indicate that Chryslers are junk and as proof you point to low resale values of old minivans then 2 pages later say that the truck you wanted (10 year old Dodge) was too expensive. Incongruous.

 

Horatio says: "Instead of comparing neon to civic I had to bring the Breeze into it? HA. Don't you know it's the same car?"

No, sorry I wasnt aware of that, funny since I was a mech at a dodge truck chrysler/plymouth dealer and I dont see the similarity... lets see, not the same size, not the same motor, not the same letter designation, nothing from the 2 cars is really compatible, just dont see it... You better call the parts guys at the dealership and tell them that they are the same, they sure have a lot of parts for the Breeze, Stratus and Cirrus(which ARE all the same car) that should be fitting on the Neons and your the only one that can explain how they fit(or should) especially since the mechanics sure cant get them to work.

Only thing I can figure is that YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOUR TALKING ABOUT! Have you ever even seen, been in or driven a Breeze/Stratus/Cirrus?

By the way, doesnt matter what you say, I took my comparison recall figures directly from the nhtsa website also, and they were all correct, so from '96 to '05 there was a 13 vs. 23 difference in favor of the neon over the civic, each the cheapest car in the lines. Neon won out over Civic by 10 recalls less, but yet you still argue that the jap owned but made here civic is better? Then when you actually got your figures you lumped all of the models and brands together, talking about a twist of reality. Multiply the recall figures your comparing for honda and acura by 10 times at least to make up for the number of autos produced by Chrysler corp vs. Honda motors to get a real world figure.

From what I gather about what your saying, you also feel that the mexicans and canadians dont build quality either, dude, your gonna have one helluva time buying your next new vehicle trying not to get a car that has parts from or is built in the USA, Mexico or Canada and that goes for all of the domestically made foriegn brands too.

All I can say is WOW...

 

people please ..... limit your posts to under 20 billion letters..

 

This topic always manages to generate a lot of emotion........

 

in 1982 I bought a 75 ford torino, had 300K on the ticker, and never a prob, and THEN I took a turn in front of a bank in Fla and the front passenger A frame left me and took out their newly planted display yard..... DAMN, I should have asked for a RECALL................. instead it cost me $1000 bucks to fix the garden......LOL............

by the way, it had 305k on it ....hated to lose the old broad....... [:'(] [sm=americanasmiley.gif]


Damn, I love the Forum........................