I can turn the key, I get radio, A/C, and lights, but I hear no power going to fuel pump and nothing from the starter, no solenoid clicking. I only hear clicking coming from the relays. Good charged battery, good connections.

I have tested the fuses and relays, they are good for the most part. I have swapped them, as well as replaced a few that fell apart. Not sure why I have zero power to both the fuel pump and/or starter.

Thanks in advance.

 

Starter - Remove the starter relay and jump contacts 30 to 87 on the relay socket. Starter should spin keys in your pocket. If it spins the starter, fuse and half the wiring in the circuit are good. To check the ignition switch check for 12vdc at contact 86 with the switch at start. If you see power the switch, PTC and wiring are good.

Pump - Remove the fuel pump relay. Jump contacts 30 to 87 on the relay socket. Pump should spin keys in your pocket. This proves the fuse, pump, pump connections and wiring to the pump from the PDC are good.

If you were checking for power directly at the pump or starter and not seeing power the above steps cut the systems in half and tell you if the output side of each circuit is working or not. If all the above check good then you have to look at the control side of the circuits meaning the half of the circuits that control power to each of the relay coils.

Model year? Any recent maintenance?

 

Yes sorry, its a 1997 Dodge Caravan 3.8L. No recent maintenance. I have been experiencing some stalls for the past few weeks. Thought maybe o2 sensors, but now with this issue, I held off on those costly repairs.

Now to the hard part. Can you explain like I'm 5 how to jump it. I have zero ideas how to do that.

 

Ok I jumped it. I get power to both the starter and fuel pump. Where do I go from there?

 

How are you checking the health of the battery? Chattering relays is a sign of low power. Best test is a load test done free at most parts stores. Lights/radio draw little current. The starter draws lots.

All of this checks the control side of each relay circuit:

Getting 12vdc at contact 86 with ign at run or start? Once the PCM sets the ground this power actuates the relay coil closing the contacts sending power on to the starter. If you're getting power, install the relay but pop it up just enough to jump contact 85 to ground. Turn the key to start. If it starts it means the PCM isn't setting the ground to the starter relay coil. That could be because the PCM isn't sensing park from the transmission range sensor, the VTSS (alarm system) has failed, the PCM itself is bad or there's an open wire or poor connection.

Remove the fuel pump relay. Check for 12vdc at contact 85 key at run or start. Not there? Circuit breaker PTC 1 on the junction block (interior fuse panel) may be bad. Voltage is there? Means the pump relay coil is getting power. It needs a ground from the PCM. Pop the pump relay up enough to ground contact 85. Turn the key to run. If the pump works either the wire from the PCM is open or the PCM is bad.

On a general note it may be worth your while to inspect the connections on the bottom of the PDC (underhood fuse box). They can be a corrosion magnet and make your life miserable. You mentioned relays/fuses?? fell apart. Could be there's corrosion internal to the PDC.

Seeing a check engine light? Have you checked for codes? Even if the light isn't on there may be pending codes saved in the PCM. Most scanners will show them. Are you seeing a constant alarm light? Any other accessories not working?

Have you noticed a pattern? On nearly any relay contact 30 and 87 are the relay output contacts with 30 being power and 87 the ground. Contacts 86 and 85 control the relay coil with 86 being power and 85 ground.

Want the wire diagrams? Send me a private message including an email address to send them to.

 

POWER: When I jump the relays both the fuel pump and starter at the same time, I hear the pump prime and the the starter cranks. Only problem I am have is everything working in sync with each other when I turn the key, which does nothing. I do not have a voltmeter at the moment, but I have bought a new computer (PCM/ECC) for the van. If that is not the issue then I am going to have to buy one and test every darn wire, relay or whatever.

RELAYS: I did take the whole PDC apart, and nothing looks corroded or lose, everything looks square. Also, the relays only fell apart when I tried to take them out to swap and replace.

CODES: The van only shows a CEL when the van is running, when I turn the key to the ON position the CEL does not come on at all. I have tried to get codes from the local parts store, but they can't find any.

UPDATE: I put the new PCM in and everything is working as it should. I will keep you posted if anything goes wrong. Thanks for all the help.