(old post)

"My 96 began to have electrical problems like the blinkers not working properly, the cruise control not working, etc. Then one day the car decided to die, after much diagnosis, we got the car to finally crank by replacing the Starter. The car really wanted to start but it wouldn't turn over. At this point we smelled gas and pulled the plugs out and they were soaked in gasoline. We replaced the plugs and tested the wires. The car has spark as well. We soon took it to a dealership and they realized that the fuel injector was not seated properly. We reseated and tested all the fuel injectors with an Oms meter, they were all good. My father seems to think that when we took off the intake manifold and replaced the vacuume lines, we hooked them up wrong, or there is a leak in the vac lines. I am like 95% certain they are all hooked up correctly. I think it might have something to do with the PCM/ECM computer and I don't know whats wrong. We are at a standstill because everything in chilton tells us to test the car with it running, and we can't get it to start in the first place. Anyone with some insite, I'd appreciate it, thanks."



update....

took it to a mechanic, but i think he's trying to screw me over...he told me that apparently my timing belt is off by 6-7 teeth....but this makes no sense for 2 reasons. a) the car was running and then stopped, noone touched the timing belt b) the car has an interference motor (listed by the manufacturer as an engine whose values might contact the pistons if the camshaft was rotated separately from the camshaft)......

let me note a bit of history on this vehicle. we had to replace the alternator on the car about a year or so ago....when we did we put the timing belt off one tooth...it blew the valves on the head of the engine....it blew the heads by just cranking the engine of the car, it cranked, then got stuck because it was an interference motor (the valves broke off)....

this guy is telling me that my timing belt somehow slipped 6-7 teeth (even though the tensioner is still tight)...and that even though it cranks, the valves might or might not be in tact.....is it possible for the valves to just bend....and is this sort of advice from this mechanic even possible??? Anyone with any other ideas on whats going on?

 

Vacuum lines would have nothing to do with your problems

1st why did you have the timing belt off to replace the alternator
2nd one tooth off with the timing belt will not cause the damage you are describing. Sonds to me like you were more like 180 degrees out of rotation. At less than 3 or 4 teeth off the pistons will not contact the valves.

yes the valves can bend when they come in slight contact with the pistons, This is all that will happen the majority of the time and even then it is usually only 2 or 3 valves. The only way the valves will have broke off is if the belt is way off or if the engine is spinning at high rpms

 

6/7 teeth is enough to cause MAJOR damage even just cranking it over ...
the rest Jim covered very well ...

 

ok i understand what u mean by it is possible to bend...but i don't see how it is possible that this belt slipped 6/7 teeth over night....i mean it was running one day...then it kinda died and wouldn't start one morning....so i replaced the starter...then it just doesn't want to start....cranks n wants to turn over but won't turn over......

i don't understand how it can magically slip 6/7 teeth out of nowhere...i mean 1-2 would be an understandable slip....but apparently the mechanic said the tensioner was still tight, and the belt needed to be replaced, but i know when i changed the belt out a year ago 2 put in a new altinator, i put a new one it...i can't imagine the belt to be in that bad of a condition.....

i'm going to take the car back from the mechanic, b/c i'm not going to pay for 7-8 hours of labor to fix the timing....i kno i can do that on my own....my problem is...if i do fix the timing....how do i tell if i need to fix the valves....i mean if the valves "bent" then how do i tell w/ out breaking the gasket seals to open the engine...also, if my car doesn't start when i fix the timing...what else could be a problem......i don't kno i'm asking every1 because i get a feeling this guy is purpously tyring to screw me over....he's had my car for litterly over a week before he even took a look at it....so 1st thing in my mind points to a lousey mechanic....so if i hav to i'm taking my busniess elsewhere....but i'm already 120 in the hole for his "diagnostic"....on top of the other parts i've already tried to fix this problem........anyone with any ideas....i'm stuck 2 mths now w/out a working avenger....

 

thats like saying your car shouldnt get a flat tire over night..

not everything takes weeks or months, some things just happen..

if you think he's a lousy mechanic why did you go to him in the first place?

if you're capable take the car back and check it yourself (you'll have to "break the gasket seals to open the engine").

if you don't want to do it pay a mechanic to do it, otherwise get a new engine, those are your 2 choices.

 

Since it suddenly died I'd bet an electrical failure as in the relays or the CPS ...
How it jumped who knows it's possible but highly unlikely as even cranking would damage things

Once timing belt is checked you can run a compression test to verify the valves ect are in good shape

 

Check the timing belt alinement yourself. Remove both upper timing belt covers and set the crank to TDC. There is a notch cut in the crank pulley and there is indicators on the lower timing belt cover. Then the cam marks are in the cam gears and they aline with marks in the valve covers.

If they line up, you timing belt did not skip.

Do you have fuel and spark? I'm willing to say you do NOT.

Check the fuel pump relay and ASD relay. Also check the CPS.

 

actually, i do have fuel, i do have spark, i do have compression......i checked and so did the mechanic......both relays work. I took the CPS out at one point, but i don't have the tool to check to see if its any good...is it possible that by taking it out it messed up the timing or something? i don't think so, but i know we did have the CPS out at one point, only to realize we didn't have the tool to check to see if it was working....it looked okay by visual inspection, but that doesn't say much...

the mechanic checked the timing belt allignment...he said when he checked the notch on the belt cover the gear wasn't alligned, and was about 6-7 teeth off...i don't know what he's talking about as of yet....i should get the car towed back tonight......more to update as more information rolls in...but as we know working on an avenger isn't the easiest thing....i've taking the timing belt off before....the shop says its an 8 hour job, but i kno it can take longer than that b/c of the cramped spaces and the difficulty of turn radius' like on the tensioner....but anyways...more to come as it rolls in...thanks everyone for all your help so far, i've heard nothing but good theories and suggestions from here so far

 

cps testing procedure at the top of the forum ... all you need is a voltmeter