Another question...

I was looking around and saw some ads for a TB spacer. Anyone have any experience with these? What brand?

Thanks!

 

Here's a link (from "The Burning Rom"'s signature)
In short: they don't work. On the link provided, they actually lost 2HP and 7 lb. ft. of torque, as well as 30 minutes of install time.

 

... and I'm guessing another 30 minutes of uninstall time.

But people keep getting them, and Turbonators, and so on and so forth.

 

Thanks for the info! I will stay away from it

 

Intake spacers are a good thing. If someone installed one and lost power, then there is a seal problem, EGR problem, etc.

 

my thought process goes like this on a throttle body space on fuel injection, i have a pretty good understanding of fuel injection (mostly ford) but im not a professional mechanic

essentially the spacer adds to the volume of the intake. if the volume increases i would assume that the negative pressure decreases inside the intake manifold. the computer decides how much fuel to inject based on information from several sensors, one of those being the manifold absolute pressure (MAP) sensor. since the actual pressure inside the manifold is lower i bet that the fuel injectors fire less fuel (because it senses less air because it measures pressure not volume) into the motor and therefore reduces the power.

Now on a carbed motor an increase of manifold volume just means more space for air and fuel prior to entering the combustion chamber, resulting in an increase in power.

can anyone else confirm or deny this? and with a good explanation..

 

kopaco - can you locate a reputable 3rd-party source with dyno graphs to prove there's a benefit?

 

The spacer does not add to the volume of the intake. You're not porting or enlarging anything by adding it. If anything, it lengthens the intake, as it just takes the TB and moves it up 1-2". But doing that doesn't allow any extra air to flow in. It just makes it so the air has to travel that much farther to reach the combustion chamber...which gives it that much more of a chance to lose velocity...and in most cases it restricts the flow of air by having a hole in it smaller than the bore of your TB. It also introduces TURBULENCE into the intake. The turbulence is meant to help the fuel mix more efficiently. But since the fuel on a fuel injected vehicle is injected directly into the combustion chamber, it's not doing that at all. It's just creating turbulence...in an intake system where you want as smooth of an air flow as you can get. Smoother air flow = faster air flow = more air getting into the engine. How swirling the air would allow more in (as they claim) is beyond me. [&:]

The link that has been posted already explains it best. Especially this part: Does a chunk of metal really need to cost $100? [8D]

If someone can produce a dyno graph from a reputable THIRD PARTY source (as horatio suggested), that showed there was a benefit, then that would change what we've all come to know and believe from the 3rd party dyno runs that have already been done...and from looking logically at how they work and what they're supposed to accomplish....which just isn't possible on a fuel injected vehicle. A vehicle where the fuel doesn't hit the air until the end of the intake stroke, and by then it's too late to do anything more to it. It's going to be compressed and ignited shortly after that.

 

Well technically there's a few cubic inches of added intake manifold volume (only as much as the material removed from the TB spacer though), which would in theory only help with throttle tip in. I know one of the problems with removing your intake plumbing and just throwing a filter right on the TB is that you don't have a volume of filtered air to get sucked in the instant you open the throttle, creating a slight lag. It's something Subaru guys have been playing with for YEARS - the way the 01 intake is set up on the RS you can put a filter right at the throttle body, but it kills response.

 

I am going to have to agree with the people who are not for this upgrade. I have a 04 and the only thing I noticed was an annoying whistling when you hit the gas. Everyone in my town is asking me if I have a turbo or something since it sounds like a diesel's turbo. I am going to uninstall mine today. By the way, my tb was a Helix Power Tower Throttle Body Spacer that cost me $90. Unreal for some bs part made for carb motors and not injected one's.