The whole thing in itself confuses me a bit.. lol. So you still use the factory engagement lever? so guess that takes care of the transfer case, but what happens at the axle end. A while back I was planning on puting a truetrac up front as well as the back. They recomended one in the back only because the front could bind up if you should gain traction. Aparently the front driveshaft still spins when in 2HI according to my friend. (im guilty.. i havent seen my truck in almost a month now so I couldnt tell ya.) Well they said not to put one up in the front because if I tried to turn, it could still bind up because one wheel is locked reguardless, if you put the truetrac. (idk... i get fed a lot of non-sense so I may be wrong.) On this one website it said it work like hubs. so... how does it really work. Like if I put a detroit locker up front, then... if it is disengaged, it would still be open? but it couldnt could it because it locks the axles? omg I'm so confused. This one website says that "Disengage Posi-Lok while in 4wd low range to eliminate steering bind, in effect giving you the benefits of 2wd low range." So it completely disables the front axle more or less right? I mean i get that part... but, am I looking at it the wrong way? If someone wouldnt mind taking a minute to set me straight, it would be appreciated! I have no $$$ this summer for a detroit, but would like to understand the advantage of using this, and in conjunction with the front axle. Not so much the use for 2wd lo, but... since it works like hubs aparently..., i could put a locker in the front then right, and only engage it when i need it? If so, this would be a super cheap hub conversion!

Thanks in advance
pcfixerpro

 

in 2 wd the axle shafts turn freeley all the time, the frint drive shadt duz not tun, the axles are disconected by the CAD unit, to have 2wd lo, you replace the CAD unit with a posi lok so the front axles are not engauged with the transfer case but when the lever for the posi lok is pulled, however your friend was right about not wanting to put truetrac up front when its in 4wd with the truetrac bot wheels are spinning at the same speed, so when you turn the wheel one has to spin a bit on the ground so if you were to get traction all od a sddon while tuenning that spinning tire would grab

 

Basically a Posi lock stops the coupling of the passenger side axle shafts. So the whole 2wd low thing really is not accurate, but it sort of accomplishes it depending on what style differential you have.

Your friend is right in that on a stock Ram, the front driveshaft does spin in 2wd, but not under torque and not 1:1 the way a full locker would effect it. The open differential in the stock Ram will apply power to the axle with the least resistence. The stock Ram drivers side axle is connected to the spider gears inside the front dfferential. As the drivers side tire rotates, the drivers side axle shaft turns and begins to rotate the spider gears inside the differential. This action results in the differential turning slightly as well, which in turn will rotate the front driveshaft.

Under power in 4wd (high or low), the transfer case sends torque to the front driveshaft. This turns the differential and then the spider gears in the differential begin to search for the side with the least resistence. With the posi lock engaged, both the drivers side and passenger side axles are receiving the toque. If one wheel begins to slip, then more and more power is sent to that side robbing the other side of any torque.

So with the posi lock disengaged in 4wd, the side with the least resistence will always be the passenger side inner axle which is now not connected to anything and free to spin inside the axle housing. So in a round about way, you will have the t-case engaged in 4wd low, but no usable power will be delivered to the front wheels because the passenger side inner axle shaft would be where the spider gears are directing the power.....so you have 2wd low....sort of.

If you install a full locker like the Detroit locker, you change the scenario completely. Now with the t-case in 4wd low and the posi lock disengaged, you would have power going to the drivers side axle and to the passenger side inner axle, but not the passenger side outer axle. So with a locker, you will always have the drivers side axle powered and not get 2wd low. However, this "poor mans selectable locker" is quite popular on the trail. Guys with full lockers in the front of their Dodges (Jeeps, and even Toyotas) use this "trick" all the time. Without a Posi lock or some means of disconnecting one axle shaft, guys with full lockers in the front have steering bind while they are trying to turn. But with the posi lock, they can temporarily disconnecta (passenger side with a Dodge) axle shaft and be able to turn easier. Then when they are straight again, they reconnect the posi lock and they are back to full 100% axle lock up.

With a Limted slip differential in the front of your Dodge, you will have some characteristics that may be undesirable, but Jeep owners that have the same basic axle set up that Dodges have, put LSD in the front all the time. With your truck in 2wd and having a LSD in the front, the drivers side axle shaft turns with the drivers wheel. This then turns the gears inside the differential, but instead of spider gears always searching for the least resistence like in an open differential, the LSD uses clutches or cones or helical gears to split the power to both wheels. This means that the differential will be spinning at a 1:1 rate with the axle(instead of being sort of drug along with the spider gears like in the case of the open diff). That means the front driveshaft will be spinning all the time when in 2wd and if not balanced properly, or subjected to steep angles (like from a lift kit), you may get driveline vibrations. Other than this, there are no issues in 2wd with a LSD in the front of your Dodge.

Now in 4wd and with the posi lock engaged, the LSD will supply power to both front wheels. However, while turning, the LSD will not bind like the full locker because it is not 100% full lockup like a locker. The LSD allows for different speeds while cornering so the steering bind you feel with a LSD is way less than with a full locker. Most guys who have put a LSD in the front of their Dodge, cannot tell any adverse characteristics at all.

A limited slip in the front of your Dodge is a great choice. Especially when coupled with a Posi Lock IMHO. You will not be able to tell it's there in 2wd (providing your driveshaft is balanced properly), and in 4wd, there is very little to no steering bind like in a full locker.

A full locker in the front of youe Dodge is also a workable option providing you know what you have and you use it in combination with your posi lock to help you steer off road.

It's late and I'm tired so if this did not come out making sense I'm sorry, but bottom line is a Detroit Truetrac is a great choice for the front of your Dodge, especially for a daily driver or occasional 4 wheeler. For somebody that wheels more than they use their truck for transportation, a full locker is doable as long as you have a posi lock (or a hub conversion kit).

BTW, I had a Detroit Trutrac in the front of my truck and I loved it. In 2wd I never felt it at all despite it turning the driveshaft more than an open diff does (and yes as I said above, your driveshaft does spin in 2wd with an open diff). In 4wd it was very managable (and I did not have a posi lock). I truely did not feel any steering bind with it at all (none more than 4wd puts on naturally anyway). The way a LSD allows for different speeds on each tire sort of eliminates any of that. It is highly misunderstood too, so don't feel bad.

To be honest,I have also had a full locker in the front of my Toyota Tacoma, and although it's a bit weird feeling while turning, it was very managable and I did not mind it at all despite all the "web tech's" telling you not to do it. The full front locker does take a bit of commitment on your part to live with it that way though.

The Truetrac however will be virtually undetectable in both 2wd and 4wd, and is a great traction aiding modification.

 

Hmm... how would the posi lok cable and the powertrax mix together since it is an auto locker?? open when no torque is applied, locked when torque is applied. with the posilok unhooked and in 2 HI, what happens? does the one wheel up front still locked?

 

so a lincoln locker would be nice on a D44.. since you break the inner and out shafts when you want.. and your not always turning the front axle/DS in 2hi

 

Well thats what I was thinking, but that doesn't mean I'm right. I'm not quite sure.. haha, thats why I figured i'd ask. I bet "nhlbill" would know and hopefully he will check back... lol he seems to know his stuff. It was somethign that pop'd in my head and didn't know if anyone had tried it. nhlbill established that with a detroit locker, the driver side?? wheel will be locked whether in 4wd or 2wd and will spin with the driveshaft. I just didnt know how that would work with the powertrax if the same wheel would still be locked or not.

 

very good explanation bill.

 

The Powertrax No-slip like it's cousin the Lockrite are normally locked, and not normally open as most would think. Then under no torque or very light torque conditions, like when you go around a corner, both of those products will allow one side to turn faster than the other. There is a light clicking associated with these "lunchbox" lockers when they ratchet and allow one side to turn faster than the other. But put any bit of torque on them and they will remain 100% locked.

So using them in the front of a Dodge in 2wd would be virtually undetectable (unless asI posted earlier you have an out of balance driveline). So in 2wd, the drivers side tire spins which always spins the drivers side axle shaft. This will also spin the locker and the carrier. Which also spins the R&P and the front driveshaft. It will also spin the inner passenger axle shaft. but because the inner passenger axle shaft is not connected to anything, there is no adverse affect in 2wd at all except some light clicking noises.

In 4wd, the powered front driveshaft will spin everything up front. Since the front shaft is under power when your on the gas, the locker remains locked all the time. On my Tacoma that had a lockrite in the front, I could get the locker to ratchet ifI managed to get one wheel in the air andI had little to no torque (gas). I could hear the light clicking noise while it ratcheted, but the second I gave it even the slightest bit of gas, the locker was locked. So by being locked pretty much all the time, it lead tothe weird feeling while driving off road with a front axle fully locked. While I could turn, even on some sharp turns, I could definetely tell the turning radius was limited. So operating a fuly locked front axle with no way of turning it off is not for everyone.

Now with a Posi-lock, you would be able to unlock the coupler that joins the inner passenger axle shaft to the intermediate passenger axle shaft. This is where the "poor mans selectable locker" term comes into play. By operating the posi-lock you are "unlocking" the passenger side axle which means just the drivers side would be the only one powered. While this is not how a true selectable locker works, it effectively accomplishes a similar result which is to go from both front wheels being locked and powered evenly to just one of them getting all the power (the drivers side). This will allow you to turn much easier,just like a truck with an open differential.

It would still be much easier on your drivetrain and front axle to just leave it as an open differential. A step up in traction would be to add a Limited slip differential to your front axle. Finally, the most traction you can add is to install a locker (and a posi-lock so you can control it). Each step has it's advantages and disadvantages and you have to decide what is the most important to you when deciding to do a mod like this. My personal veiw on this is that unless you are doing some heavy off roading very frequently,I would just leave the front open , or install a LSD.

The other thing to consider is cost. By the time you buy a Powertrax No-Slip and a Posi Lock, you might as well have bought a selctable locker like an ARB, or an Auburn ECTED.

If I had mine to do all over again,I would have put in a Detroit Locker in the rear axle, and left the front open, but installed a Posi Lock. This combination would get you through some very challenging trails, mud and terrain. It would be dependable, because the 9.25 rear axle is very strong (where the D44 is very weak). It would also allow you to have low range while not having any front wheels powered which is handy some times.

But we can't go back and I'm stuck with what I have now, but if I were some of you guys asking about this, that is what I would do.

Bill