okay cm I gotcha now great explanation I thought you were refering to the timing chain itself. Are there any affordable obd2 scanners that will give me the info we need, or if anyone knows of somewhere in michigan that will do this for me?

 

well i looked on summit and found a few different scanners would one of these work?

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/BBE-ATU/

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/AXY-4000/?image=large

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUN-CP9180/

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUN-CP9410/

btw I have an actron 3 obd2 scanner, unfortunatley it only reads codes, If I would have known they made sensor testing ones 4 years ago I wouldn't have dropped 250 on it

 

you need a laptop for the auto tap and it should do what you want to do.

auto xray should do what you need.

i have the actron cp9175 and it does read some sensors but it just tells you if they're working or not. i doubt the cp9180 is much different.

the fourth one is just a basic code reader.

cmckenna, that answered them. since the map works at 100% from a cold start to operating temp then i doubt that it would have a big impact on the rough cold idle.
the reason i asked about the map is because i have heard that the diaphragm inside it can crack and impair its operation but not make it throw a cel.

 

I like the idea of being able to use my laptop which is why i checked out the b&b one, seems like it would be easier to read the info and such. So i guess now i just need to save up 200 bucks

 

you need to find someone that has one and see how they like it. either that or find a video tutorial on one. if i had known that my code reader wasn't as capable as an auto xray then i would have gone for the auto xray.

 

Software and hardware package is what you need. Now, they are a dime a dozen so, shouldn't be too hard to find one that fits your budget.

EDIT: I wasn't going to comment or make any recommendations for any scan tool but, after thinking about it for a while, I felt the need to at least mention a few things.

The Actron tuners well, I don't want to get in trouble here by posting about some companies products in an open forum here so, I will remain silent.

I don't make recommendations on what products to go with because I don't have experience with USING those models personally and, the last thing I want to have happen is you, the end user, to buy one based on my recommendation and have it fail. All I can do is to tell you to go to the ones your looking at and go to the related forum and note the user feedback. You will find out in less than five minutes.

This applies to SW packages as well by the way. There's quite a few out there that don't work, they don't upgrade often and they are loaded with bugs.

Again, I wish I could help you more in this area.

Chris McKenna

 

CM i saw earlier that you said the only sensor that operates in the open loop is the crank sensor, even though I am not getting a code would it be helpful to go ahead and change it anyways.

 

Actually DD, there's three I listed there. When you first hit the key, there's a bunch of sensors that provide immediate data to the PCM. Those were also listed out as well as the following three.

-CKPS
-ECT
-IAT


FYI: All the sensors are used initially and, once it is actually started and warming up, it uses those three primarily.

Now, I must tell you that when changing the damn sensor (CKPS) the 3rd party sensors sometimes don't work and I will tell you what the Dodge service tech told me a few days ago after I replaced mine twice and not one worked. Knowing this will save you money because, once you install the electronic item-it can not be returned. Unless, you get crafty and learn how to use rubber washers so that there is no evidence. I have done this myself.

No marring of the surface and they will never know it was installed.

Back to the tech info:

The dealer parts are screened to spec. The ones that fail the test are then rejected and later sold off to 3rd parties such as Auto Zone, Napa, etc.

I tried two CPS and none of those worked either. The one from Pep had zero voltage right out of the box and, the one from Crapa Auto was all over the map as it flipped my timing out by x - amount of degrees where it was misfiring, popping and stalling.

You need to know that. Also, I am not 100% positive but, I think when they are changed out, the PCM 'may' need to be flashed to offset the new part.

When the motor gets old, and / or hi milage, the PCM needs to be re-flashed or updated to compensate for lower / reduced intake vacuum etc so, the parameters in the PCM will need to be changed / adjusted to compensate and, one of the main parameters to check is the CPS and CKPS offset.

 

when you say the pcm needs to be changed do you mean unhooking the main terminals and crossing them?

Also I know that the iac is good but whats an ect?

 

Sorry for the delay here, was out in the garage. Ok, what was meant when I said that the computer has to be flashed means that you reprogram the PCM with new parameters through the use of a tuner or, tuning software on a laptop.

The first thing that must be done is someone (who knows what they are doing) has to look at the timing in the software. Then, based on the values, can adjust those parameters for the crank and cam offset to make it run better. This compensates for lower vacuum and provides better timing.

When the engine ages, the program doesn't match any longer due to engine wear. So, now you have a mismatch on some of the settings vs. the engine readings such as vac and compression. So, you adjust for it at the PCM by programming in new values or new ranges for certain parameters.

This is not something that you can do without experience. A certified tech who's taken the classes or, anyone who has been taught how to do this can successfully program in new values.

ECT stands for Engine Coolant Temperature sensor.