So...!

The front end rebuild on my 2004 Dodge RAM 2500 5.9L Cummins I have been posting about for the past couple of weeks is finally underway. The steps on this process that I thought would be difficult have been easy and the steps I thought would be easy have been a bearcat.... Let me explain. I apologize now, this will be a long post but if you are noob like me doing your ball joints and U Joints, read on. Trust me it is worth it...

So I finally started yesterday on the Driver's side (I will be doing BOTH the driver's side and passenger side on this truck). I was expecting to spend the better part of a day alone pulling off the hub assembly and possibly the rotor. The rotor came off in 10 minutes and the hub took me 30 minutes or less. See below in the lessons learned what I did for the hub. The right tools work well...

I am to the point where I have stripped everything and have removed the driver's side Ball Joints. And then the fun has begun... (I know, you are probably saying.. really??? It should be easy now!?! Yeah, Keep reading...)

So, I got to the driver's side U Joint that also needed replacing. Since I got the heavy duty OTC 6530 ball joint press kit for this job (don't even think about doing this job without a kit like this By The Way), I wasn't too worried about pressing out a U Joint and pressing in the new one. No probs right? Ha! I take out the U joint to find that my old mechanic for some unknown reason welded on the caps of this U Joint... The axle yokes are just fine, not damaged. I have read online that you only ever do this with yokes that are damaged. Der.... A different mechanic did the other UJoint on the passenger's side of this truck a month ago and reported the same thing - that the U Joint caps had welds on them. They cut the welds off and put in a new U Joint in with the C clips only to hold it in so I thought I would do that on this U Joint as well....

So, I dremmeled off the welds and finally pressed out the U Joint... Great. I go to put the new one in (Precision Part Number 464)... Didn't fit. Nice.

So I proceeded to look online and go all over the place in town this morning and I have found that the Precision Brand Part # 464 U Joints (Cost $50.00 at Napa) are slightly too large for this truck but are the ones that are supposed to fit it. I can't even get this one in my axle yokes so I scratched this one immediately. I even found one post online that said because of this tight fit, the U Joint will run hot and wear out very quickly... So, I go over to, gasp, the Dodge Dealership, where they take out the Mopar U Joint (part # 5086665AE). Of course it fits like a glove and went in no sweat. It cost me $135.00 after tax. Ugh. Well, since this project of mine is at a complete standstill because of this I just bought it. The Precision U Joint was only $50 so I just ate $85 for convenience...

Other lessons learned on this project:

1.) Your tools are absolutely key if you ever want to do this Ball Joint and U Joint job yourself on a 3rd Gen 2500.

2.) The hub was rusted on good. I PB Blastered the crap out of it the night before and during the project. I used a combination of the Lisle Hub cracking air chisel tool (link: http://www.genosgarage.com/LISLE-382.../#.UlmiFvUo7IU) and the Snap On tool for the power steering process (http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/print...&email=true#Li). I am going to catch flak for this next statement, but if you are a noob like me, don't even think about pulling these hubs unless you have a BFH (Big Friendly Hammer) and these two tools (you will need an Ingersoll Rand or better air chisel like I got as well for the chisel tool). I rotated between the dead blow hammer, the Lisle Chisel tool (on my air chisel) and the Snap On power steering wedge tool. The hub came off with a little bit of work but nothing bad. Just take it from me, you need these tools. I am not a tool rep, I am not a licensed meachanic, I am just a 32 year old guy living in North Dakota sick of paying the mechanic to do this stuff. So take it for what it is worth...

3.) The Nitro Cat 1200 Impact air wrench ( ) I got has been invaluable. Like I said above, I live in North Dakota and the rust on this truck was unbelievable. I used this thing for a good number of bolts and whatnot. The biggest area where it was most useful was when I used it along with my Heavy duty OTC Ball Joint Press kit to press out my U Joint that still had residual welds on the caps even after I ground them off. I could not have pressed out that U Joint without this tool as it helped in busting out the remaining parts of those U Joint cap welds. The one side shot like a gun when it released from these welds...

4.) Lastly, all these guys out there saying you can give a gentle tap to get your outer tie rod end to drop from the steering yoke are smoking something. I beat on that thing for a half hour with every hammer imaginable. I finally got my tie rod separator out (pickle fork basically) like I should have done right away and got in there and it was out in a minute. Don't do like I did and take the bolt off of it. Leave it on a little bit so it doesn't come tumbling down when it releases. Again, if you are a noob, go to Northern Tool and get what is called a "Tie Rod Separator". It is a pickle fork basically to remove the tie rod fromt he steering yoke.. Now, this causes one small problem that is currently halting this project to a dead standstill for me at the moment - using this tie rod separator will (and I do mean WILL) break / nic your rubber seal on that tie rod end... Read further now for my questions...

Questions I have:

1.) So, about that outer tie rod end that I removed with the pickle fork... So, I thought, well I can just replace this - no biggy. Ha! Come to find out in all my running around today, Dodge has basically discontinued all previous steering linkage parts and got a whole new steering column... This means you can try like I did to dink around at Napa to find out what part you actually need and how to replace it, or you can go with the dealership and get charged $360 for the whole new steering linkage update. So, I guess I am lost here. The rubber seal on that outer tie rod end is sitting with a half inch cut in it from the pickle fork I used. Will I be ok to leave this as is and button it back up? Or will I need to replace this? I really could use some help from somebody who has replaced these outer tie rod ends. What part number do you need (again, you will need to go Napa as they still have the old parts) and how do you remove these tie rod ends?

2.) If and when I do get these tie rod ends replaced, I am wondering how they screw into place and if I will need a major realignment done... Past how to articles and or youtube vids that any of you know of for this job would really help.

Since I have already dropped a ton of cash into this rebuild so far, I am thinking about maybe dropping another $500 to jumping in and getting this steering crap all gussied up too...

I know, I am a rambling maniac but I have had success on the stuff I have studied which is the replacement of the ball joints, hubs, shocks, and break system on this truck... I have put a month worth of research intot his and have gone from a complete noob not even knowing what a UJoint looks like to knowing more than my neighbor who has been working on cars for 30 yrs. At many of the turns in this project my neighbor has said something and he has been wrong about it. The info is out there, you need to just not take no for an answer and research the crapola out of it like I did.

But with that said, I am at a standstill now though because of this tie rod end situation. I really didn't want any steering linkage updates on this truck but since I bludgeoned the seal on this tie rod end, I may have no choice..

So, I guess this is still my cry for help!

Once I get this figured out, the joints and everything will go in real quick. I haven't struggled really at all with what I knew and researched going into this thing.

Thanks in advance everybody for any help any of you can give!

 

I just replaced my tie rods on my 2004 .. 1500 gas,, but the book sias it’s the same part number.
http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/de...3448&ppt=C0203
Moog tie rod $64.79 out the door. They had it in stock
part number ES3538
thats for a 2 wheel drive 5.9L Cummins
4 wheel is different part number

ORiellys auto parts,,..

 

So yeah, I actually did some looking online and some looking at the steering column under the truck. The one tie rod end is definitely shot. The seal is shot. I also have one other seal on the other side that is bad. I did some counting and there is like 4 joint/seals in the steering system. I am slowly but surely getting educated here too... Looking and researching online really helped. There were a couple good articles on youtube that I found today...

But, I have much larger problems.... The yoke / the driver's side axle that was held in by the U Joint I was replacing (the one with the welded in caps) is completely off in measurement. It is bent in and the U Joint wasn't even close to fitting. I got it pushed in, it seized and the grooves for the C Clips were still hidden by a good millimeter or two on each side. Not good. I destroyed my Mopar U Joint I bought today trying to get it back out. And what's worse I will need to look for these axle / spindle yokes now... I am going to start at the wreck yards in town tomorrow and prolly end up at the dealership. This is the condition I found this thing in unfortunately. I think my old mechanic bludgeoned it to death... Read below, I explain this more.

Napa laughed at me today when I asked if they had these parts...

I then tried to take the good end of that Mopar U Joint and tried to press it into the yoke part that sits in the Hub assembly just to test the fit. The fit there wasn't great either on that end and the joint was half seized there too - but, I was able to get the C clips in on both sides at least. I took punches and beat on it with wood on the caps and whatnot like people say to do and the thing only spins half free after this.... So, this driver's side axle yoke is probably bad all around and just needs replacing unfortunately.

So, there my truck sits. The driver's side completely cleaned up and ready for new Ball Joints and my new hub etc and the whole thing is held up because of this problem.

Ugh, can any of you estimate what this might cost for the driver's side axle here? So basically the two axle yokes that the U Joint holds together? I think I now know why that joint I took out yesterday was welded in - because I think it was a smaller joint than what was supposed to be in there - I think the mechanic put in a smaller joint because these yokes were bent back then too when he did it a couple years ago. He told me back then that he had a beast of time getting the U Joint out that he replaced and it makes me think he used a hammer and badly bludgeoned the thing to the point where he needed to use a small, not the right sized U joint and some weld on the caps. No wonder the joint was beyond shot when I got to it yesterday. Uck. On an eye test even, the old U Joint I pulled out of there is smaller than the Precision Part # 464 Joint I originally couldn't even fit in and the Mopar Joint was pretty much the same way on hindsight now... The O'Reileys guy I talked to today even measured them with the measuring caliper and the U Joint that I took out was smaller on the measure as well. What a crappy deal. This is how I found these yokes. I didn;t touch any of it with a hammer or anything.

Anyways, thanks for reading the post. The good news is I am learning a ton. My wife is the nicest wife ever. She has been patient while I toil away for days on end on this.

 

So to be clear, I basically will need a stub shaft and an axle shaft for the driver's side (I think that's what it is called) for this vehicle. I have been online but haven't found much. I am looking for part numbers and prices.

Thanks anybody who can help!

 

Junk yard.. or ebay if you can wait.

 

1). The tie rod ends need to be replaced---if it falls out while you're driving, you're dead------see "rockauto.com" good place to shop for part numbers, if not parts. But they will be the best prices you can find---but can you wait? see the Moogs' in there.

2). I think you do yourself a favor and replace both axles. Welding on metal of this type is not a great idea unless its a temp fix to get you home----and this sounds like your daily driver.

I looked at car-parts.com and they have them all over the place----but they are salty.
You should be calling a bud right now seeing if you line up wheels until you get this fixed. I did mine a few years ago, the hbs were my biggest problem, the joints and axles went well. One other thing you need to be concerned about, the axles seals in the diff-------be EXTREMELY CAREFUL when you put the axles back in the prevent tearing those seals, or------you get to do it all again, gear oil will almost pour out if they're torn.

By the time you're done with this project, you'll understand why they charge so much to do it

The old tie rod ends will unscrew--measure before you pull them, put the new back in at the near the same measurement------get the alignment done.

hope this helps--good luck!!!

 

Gone Fishin, thanks for the info here!

Yeah, I have learned a whole bunch since posting last. I have definitely read about replacing both sides on that axle in this situation I find myself in here so a good ol +1 there for ya. Also, due to the fact that I had to put so much pressure on the press to get what was left of those old welds to bust on that U Joint, I am putting two and two together and I actually think that is what did these axle parts in in the end. But, like I said in the Original Post, the mechanic who changed out the originals said that they "gave him flack" and it makes me think that he still may have bludgeoned them so bad that he felt welds on the U Joint ends were needed for some odd reason... I live 2 minutes from him and I may go in and have a talk with him at some point this week about this.

Another +1 on the differential seals. I had the wife come out to support that axle as I pulled er out two days ago and warned the crap out of the fact that these seals are touchy.

So three burning questions I have right now yet:

1.) I am going to replace the whole steering column with these Napa parts below - this items list below is the exhaustive list of what I will need based on research:

269-6102 tie rod end/arm
269-6103 tie rod end/arm
269-1123 tie rod adjuster (2 of them)
SC-2964 Steering stabilizer
269-3257 Tie rod end
269-3256 Tie rod end

Now, when I get to putting those tie rod ends on do you just ream em on and call em good (after careful measurement of course)? Or do they have to be pressed in? I did a double take on one article that I saw that said they had to be pressed in for some reason.

2.) After bludgeoning my $136 Mopar U Joint yesterday in discovering that my driver side axle was completely off measurement from the torture it has endured, I have done a lot of research since then. Its like the manufactures of the AAM 9.25 forgot to think out the U Joint fitment.... Der... Anyhow, this was not my problem, but its like I see this as paying $136.00 to get an education on this point because the fitment would have been tight anyways on a perfectly measured and non bludgeoned axle from the sounds of things... I would have never known that had I not passed through this experience yesterday which forced me back onto the internet to learn what I didn't know before this.. Like you said above, I will be replacing most likely both axles at this point due to the welding in of these old U Joint caps by my old mechanic. I am going to put the SPICER #5006813 U Joints in the new axles I will get. Too many articles by people saying this is the only U Joint that you have a chance on in being a good fit on these. The other aftermarket ones like the Precision 464's get forced and are not good. That is what is sitting on the passenger side as we speak currently as this is what the other mechanic I saw a month ago put in before I got tired of paying another $500.00 for a stinken U Joint to be replaced by not me. But, my real question now is on the installation of the U Joints here on these AAM 9.25 axles.... I have researched this to death and I think I am putting these in correctly but just want to make sure. The thing that has me scratching my head is in this vid below here the guy makes some sort of mark when putting the stub shaft on the joint. What is the mark for? Don't these things just kinda just go in on the U joint and they are good? Here is the vid below. You will see him mark the stub shaft (at about the 8:20 part in the vid) for some reason when putting in that U Joint - I have literally seen this nowhere else but of course, this is literally the only vid I have seen of a AAM 9.25 U Joint done too:


3.) When I do put those axles back in and pass the seal, is there any secret to know that the splines on the shaft and axle have lined up - is there any lining up I have to do or just shove it in and watch the seal?? I ask because I know myself and I know I will get it in there and wonder if I got in, and then back er out and then... You get my drift - all things that will bust this seal. Truth be told, I am most worried about this part when its all said and done. This project is starting to get to the overwhelming point now cash wise and busting an axle seal would be really really bad . Just looking for how to tell if it is all lined up. And, oh yeah, does it need any gear oil on the end of it prior to sliding it back in? I will be greasing the smooth part that will sit on the seal - I am just wondering if anything is needed on the spline part.

Thanks for your reply above!

 

Ok, so update here. I am getting the front right and front left axle shaft assemblies sent in now complete with U Joints on them (so, the stub shaft and axle shaft for both side and they will come set with Mopar U Joints holding them together in an assembly)... This will solve my issues and I won't even have to monkey with new U Joints now either - they will be in the assemblies already. So, I will just get the assemblies and put them in!

So, questions that remain are these:

1.) On the tie rod ends I will be assembling, is there any special way to ream these down other than putting em in and ratcheting them down? Again, I thought I read somewhere that these might have to be pressed in somehow?

2.) When these new axle shafts go in, I will be putting grease on the smooth part of the axle that will mate with the seal in the diff housing. How about the spline part that is going into the diff? Does that need any gear oil or anything or can I just assemble the axle shaft with just the grease on the smooth part?

3.) Is there anything I should know about lining that axle shaft back up when it goes back into the differential? I know to watch the seal, I am just wondering if there is something special I need to know about placing that axle shaft back in from an alignment perspective..?

Thanks in advance for any replies!

 

Fred Flintstone mechanics in the vid, but it gets the point across

I PM'd you

 

Big trucks have big truck problems...you will be a better person by the time you are done sorting this out. I suspect the mark on the shaft was for ensuring that the overall axle remained balanced when put back together.

The rod ends do not really need to be pressed in. They are a cone fit so they need to be pushed in by hand firmly enough for them to catch and allow the nuts to tighten.

FRONT AXLE - C205F
INSTALLATION
(1) Clean axle shaft bore clean.
(2) Install a new axle shaft seal with Installer
8694 and Handle C-4171.
(3) Lubricate seal lip with gear lubricant.
(4) Insert axle shaft through seal, bearing, and
engage it into side gear splines. Push firmly on the
axle shaft to engage the snap-ring.
NOTE: Use care to prevent shaft splines from damaging
axle shaft seal lip.
(5) Install axle shaft O-ring.
(6) Check the differential fluid level and add fluid
if necessary.
(7) Install skid plate, if necessary.
(8) Install half shaft.

FRONT AXLE - 9 1/4 AA
INSTALLATION
(1) Clean axle shaft and apply a thin film of
Mopar Wheel Bearing Grease to the shaft splines
and hub bore.
(2) Install axle shaft through the steering knuckle
and into the differential side gears (Fig. 19).
CAUTION: Do not damage axle shaft seal during
axle installtion.
(3) Install hub bearing in the knuckle.
(4) Install hub bearing bolts and tighten to 202
N·m (149 ft. lbs.).
(5) Install ABS wheel speed sensor, brake rotor
and caliper.
(6) Install axle washer and nut. Tighten axle nut
to 179 N·m (132 ft. lbs.).
(7) Rotate axle several 5 to 10 times to seat the
wheel bearing.
(8) Tighten axle nut to final torque of 356 N·m
(263 ft. lbs.).
(9) Align nut to next cotter pin hole and install
new cotter pin.
(10) Install wheel and tire assembly.

Steve