I believe its the platform they are using. That LX (LY for the Challenger) is built to be a tank. The problem the manufactures are having is that people want both safety, price, fuel economy, and performance. Unfortuneatly, it is impossible to give them all at the same time. I think that DCX wants to make sure the Challenger is safe since they know people are going to drive it fast. With the way people are these days, if a vehicle has any small safety issue, they raise the underworld about it.

I'm not referring to something like the Crown Vic problem, more of if it doesn't get 5 stars in every category and get a perfect rating in the off set tests, they call it unsafe. Making the vehicle safe makes it weigh more. The platform they are basing the Challenger off of was in its original form intended to be used for a Mercedes whos top priorities are safety, structure, and comfort. The Challenger is about performance and style. In my opinion, they never should have used the Mercedes E-class platform in the first place. The platfom is the reason why the Challenger is going to cost considerably more than the Mustang.

They also shouldn't have used the Mercedes designed W5A580 transmission in the LX cars either. If they would have worked on the ratios a little, the 545RFE should have been the one they used. From the '99 concept the Charger was going to use the LH platform (Intrepid, 300M, LHS, Concorde, Vision, Prowler, etc.). As much as I like the looks of the current Charger, I prefer the looks of '99 concept better. The LH platform would have been better suited for the Charger. It would have been lighter, more aerodynamic, it was RWD capable (and most likely AWD capable), and considerably less expensive.

I can understand the 300C having the LX platform since it is a Chrysler and Chrysler is supposed to be about luxury (though you wouldn't know it since they added the Plymouth marketing and products to Chrysler's line). The Magnum also makes sense to use the LX.

The Challenger more than anyother one should have the LH instead of the LY platform. This would both solve the weight and price issue. It wouldn't be nuclear proof, but that isn't why a person buys a muscle car anyways.

I believe the Challenger can match the GT500 because the 6.1L is underrated. In a test that either MT or C&D did testing the Magnum SRT-8 was found to actually produce 467hp. I don't know about the actually output of the GT500, but I know it is in fact defeated by the 2000 Cobra R which didn't have a supercharger.

I've seen the Charger and 300C SRT-8s range from 4.7-4.9 secs in the 0-60 and that is with the automatic. I believe the manual will make the difference, plus if you look at the picture of the engine compartment from the concept Challenger and compare it to the SRT-8s, you'll notice they have a K&N intake on the Challenger that isn't on the other SRT-8s. Whether they include it or not in the rating, it will be more powerful than the others and maybe just enough to make the difference.

About fuel economy, I'm afraid if prices continue they way they are going that might become an issue for some. GM will be offering close to 30mpg with their Camaro with the LS2 from what I have read since it will have Displacement-On-Demand. The only problem is it seems like that DOD isn't very efficient despite what the EPA claims. I have read many cases in the magazineswhere the 5.7L-powered LX cars in real life get way better mileage than the DOD models despite the 3 mpg difference, in fact I've even seen cases where the 6.1L gets better mileage than the LS4 (5.3L in Impala/Monte Carlo SS & GP GXP) and the 6.1L doesn't even have MDS. I'd like it if they would offer the Bluetech diesel as an option on the Challenger. Selling a model that will accelerate to 60 in the mid to upper 6 sec range and can get up to 37 mpg sounds pretty good to me.

I was finished with my finals yesterday at 3:00p.m. Thank goodness that is over. My university is going to be playing in the Division 2 championship. We're NWMSU. Good luck on your finals and your team. GO BEARCATS!

 

I must say, the idea of putting a diesel in a muscle icon car is unconventional. While it is a good choice for mpg, there's three reasons why I personally wouldn't.

#1 the sound of a v8gas vs diesel is too different. Imagine pulling up to a muscle car and not hearing that throaty low growl, just a small sound of a semi.
#2. exhaust- when people see all that black smoke bellowing outta there, their gonna think you blew ur engine already-and it stinks
#3. Speed, while diesels are powerful, they lack significant hp to make a muscle car, a muscle car

I can definently see a diesel in their midsized care and the caliber(which they need to do, I think the europe ones with the diesel were round 45mpg!!!!) but putting it in a sports car, well, not for me anyways, but we all have our tastes intrepid man

and about the gt500- I do think that maybe the tranny is the reason. I love Ford stangs, but Ford does sometimes seem a little shady on their trannys. With 500ponies, 4.5 should be embaressing, but what the hell, it's a gt500, it's a legend regardless

as far as dodge engines and mpg-I don't know why they don't just MDS every engine, and every other detroit company too. I mean, there's no noticable difference on driving them, my 06HEMI has MDS and the 8 kicks in basically the split second after u mash ur foot to the ground, there's absolutely no noticable lag(it's like a thousand of a second delay time) maybe the 6.1 could push 23-24mpg with it? then put that big honkin 392 and tear everything up that is alive on the streets(I can dream can't I) lol

well tomorrow is my day of hell-3 finals spread from 8am-9pm and nothing but studying in between, but I'm sure everybody is doing the same thing
alright then, good discussion intrepid, good luck on your bearcats

 

i must say, THE STUD, that i didnt like you at first but you seem to be very knowledgable and have many good ideas and have also turned out to be a pretty nice guy.

 

They should make cars the way they use to, where you order options on or off the car individually and not a couple different packages where if you want this you have to take these other 12 items and pay for them as well even though you don't want them.

I also miss the Razor concept cars purity to performance. I wish you could get a similar version of performance purity with the Challenger, a version without all the power heated this and that. All I want is a Challenger done like the Razor, but with carpet and A/C, that's all I need and want since I always replace the stereo and speakers with my own. This would shave off a good bit of weight. Pure performance.

 

well thanks johndcjr, I came on here kinda frustrated cause detroit is taking such a hit, but I"m more me now, as my frustration was taken out, sorry for anybody being offended, I"m back to my usual self.
Yeah roadrunner, i know what you mean about simple interior. All the trinkits and options just gives way for more things to go wrong. Fewer optiong=fewer defects. I like big engine, nice exterior, some ac, power doors,windows, and a sweet stereo, that's about all that's requried to cruise in style. Maybe a convertible if we're lucky.

 

The convertible is a must if they want to keep up sales and compete fully with the Camaro and Mustang.

 

I think i'm gonna go nuts if I don't hear some kinda news about the challenger soon. DIscussion has run dry, u guys agree?

 

The last thing I read was in the current issue of Stuff where they mention it coming out in 2008 and the 425 horse Hemi version being just shy of $40,000.

 

good to hear something, and the price is cool, as long as they make an affordable model, with the 5.7 and maybe even the 3.5 HO I think it was, for the young guys or just average guys not able to drop 30k+ on a play car. My stang now is a daily driver, and I would like to see those and beast v8s all over the place. the Challenger is going to take over the world!!!!!!!!!!!........lol

 

Lol, I saw yet another recal for Toyota, and yesterday I saw a HOnda Accord Recall, and I had to post this because everybody says that americanvehicles aren't built as well as toyota or honda. Well here's Toyota's latest recall-over 500,000 for steering problems. Funny thing is you won't see this on the news, but when any detroit auto maker has a recall- as simple as a light bulb or soemthinhg, it's all over the news and people are saying "oh looket, american cars are krap" but as normal the liberal media will sweep this under the rug, here's the recall link(just one of them)
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070119/.../toyota_recall
According to 2006 reports, Toyota recalls exceeded GM recalls, and GM outsold Toyota, ouch, and as of 2007 Toyota is off to an evern worse start.
Silverado got truck of the year award-YES!!
J.D. Power's Quality award goes not to Accord, not to Camry, but Ford Fusion, congrats, here come American cars again