Cold weather warm-up/idle time?
#11
RE: Cold weather warm-up/idle time?
ORIGINAL: sallyman1
wow. i cant do that. i let mine idle for 15 minutes tonight because its -25 celcius here and -30 celcius with windchill. or is this too long still? (for US its -5 to -10 fahrenheit)
wow. i cant do that. i let mine idle for 15 minutes tonight because its -25 celcius here and -30 celcius with windchill. or is this too long still? (for US its -5 to -10 fahrenheit)
When its that cold I will plug mine in for 3 hours and make sure all 4 flaps are closed on my winterfront before I start my truck. Once started I only let it idle for 3-4 minutes before I drive 10 MPH the 7 blocks to the Hwy. Being the Freeway is a one-mile drive on the Hwy I normally have 50+ degree heat coming from the heater by the time I reach the Freeway. I also don't drive over 55 MPH nor do I let it get above 1700 RPM’s until I see at least 150 degrees on the heat gauge. The two things that help me to get going so soon are the winterfront and I’m using 5w30 oil. The lightweight oil allows me to drive sooner as the oil does not have to warm up as much to get good oil flow like 15w40 does at 10 to 15 degrees below zero. The winterfront with all four flaps closed keeps the cold air off the radiator and engine allowing it to warm up faster.
#14
RE: Cold weather warm-up/idle time?
i was doing a search this morning on this subject, this articlegives a pretty good rundown on differing temps, my area is never that cold, down to -15 for short times. i've started plugging it in at night to aid in warm up, and bought a rad cover also.
Q: In cool and cold weather, my voltmeter jumps up and down. Is a belt slipping?
[ul][*]When the temperature is below 59 degrees, the intake manifold heater cycles to warm the air entering the cylinders. The heaters draw more current than the alternator can produce when running, so the voltmeter sees the heaters drag down the voltage. Cycling may continue for several minutes in cold weather.[*]Intake manifold heater cycles depend on the temperature of the manifold.[*]Post heat time sepends on how quickly the manifold temperature sensor warms to 59 F [/ul]
Intake Manifold Temp
Pre-Heat Cycle Time Ignition on, Engine Not Running
Post-Heat Cycle Ignition On, Engine Running
Above 59 F (15 C)
0 Seconds (no heat)
No
15 F to 59 F (-10 C to 15 C)
10 Seconds
Yes
0 F to 15 F (-18 C to -10 C)
15 Seconds
Yes
Below 0 F (-18 C) /td>
30 Seconds
Yes
Q: Will the diesel start in subzero weather?
[ul][*]The Cummins B will reliably start at temperatures to -20 degrees F without the block heater, but the engine is much happier if the block heater is used. It may take several manifold heat/start cycles before the engine fires and continues to run. Expect a large smoke cloud, engine and accessory whine, knocking, and vibration until things warm.[*]Below -20, some block heat is usually needed to get the engine to reliably fire. Always allow the oil to warm before using heavy throttle or running the engine above 2000 rpm. An electrically operated magnetic oil pan heater will help warm the oil and make the engine easier to turn over. Espar makes diesel fired block heaters for people who can't plug the truck into an electrical outlet. In cold weather Cummins Premium Blue 2000 semi-synthetic engine oil flows better than regular 15W-40, but it does not have the required SF or SG rating!. [/ul]
Q: Why Can't I use ether as a cold weather starting aid?
[ul][*]Ether is highly flammable and can be ignited by the intake manifold heater grid, causing engine damage or operator injury. [/ul]
Q: Should an additive be used in the fuel to keep it from clogging the fuel system?
[ul][*]Below 15 degrees F, wax crystals begin to form in diesel fuel. These crystals form a gell that will clog the fuel filter or fuel lines and stop the engine as the temperature drops toward 0 F. Any good "winter fuel conditioner" for diesel fuel will keep the fuel moving to at least -20 degrees. Follow the instructions on the bottle! [/ul]
Q: How can I tell when the fuel begins to gell?
[ul][*]The first hint is often an unstable idle. The idle speed may increase to 1000 rpm or more and fluctuate slowly. Next the engine will begin to lose power. Within a few minutes the engine will quit and not restart or will only restart briefly. [/ul]
Q: What can I do if the fuel has already gelled due to the cold?
[ul][*]The time proven remedy is to add a gallon of kerosene for each 10 to 20 gallons of fuel to the tank, then allow it to sit long enough for the kerosene to diffuse into the fuel. In weather below -20 degrees F, one gallon of kerosene for 10 gallons of fuel will keep things moving, but fuel economy will be reduced. Kerosene now has red dye which a DOT inspector will assume is off-road diesel. Be prepared for a hassle if you are checked.[*]Apply heat to the fuel filter to break up the wax. [/ul]
[align=center]Cold Weather Hints[/align]
From a 1995 issue of the Star Center News
By following the cold weather operating procedures in the Owners Manual, you will be able to reduce white smoke, improve cold weather starting performance, and maximize fuel burn efficiency in the combustion chamber.
The engine block heater usage is recommended as follows:
1) With temperatures above 40 deg F, the block heater is not needed.
2) With temperatures between 40 deg F and 0 deg F, the block heater is suggested.
3) With temperatures below 0 deg F, the block heater is required.
From: Drdonnelly <Drdonnelly@aol.com>
To: ramtruck
when it gets really cold and you can't plug in, cycle the grid heater twice.
Warming up a diesel is funny. When the air is really cold, it hardly heats enough to burn the fuel that is injected. Letting it sit and idle only makes it worse, as the chamber temp does not rise much. Most of the fuel energy does work (runs the engine), and the poor thing can't warm up. You gotta load it some to get some waste heat in the exhaust and water jackets. However, you can't load it too much because it can't burn all that fuel, and you just wash the cylinder walls and puke out white smoke (unburned fuel).
I start mine, let it run maybe 30 seconds to get oil pressure and then a bit of time after the gauge comes up. Then I drive gently for a bit--downhill grade is OK. Just get a bit of time on it with very light load--moving the truck gently is enough. After a couple to several minutes when it is just beginning to know it is running, put on a little more load...climb a hill taking it kinda easy, or something. I try to keep egt down to say 600 max at this point (in the manifold). Pretty soon, the water temp gauge will budge and your battle is over. The giant has awakened and is ready for work.
Now I know the above is "extreme" babying of the engine in a way. But, it works and is as close to optimum as I can come up with in the real world. One thing is for sure--don't start it and idle for 5 minutes at the house. That will clog the catalytic converter and coke up the injectors because the fuel can't flash off them completely. You're much better off loading it just enough to keep egt at or just above 300 degrees.
As for the aftercooler, partially blocking the radiator does little to help when the thermostat is closed, but it will help the engine get warmer air in the cylinders. The intercooler (really an aftercoooler) will only cool the intake air too much at this point if you don't partially block it when the engine is frigid.
Joe
Subject: Re: DiRT: Cummins Winter Prep Questions
From: "Rod Snaith" <snaith.farms@sk.sympatico.ca>
To: DiRT
> do you find that the Ram keeps everyone's toes warm
> when running down the highway in sub-zero stuff? Or does anyone put
> any type of cover over the radiator to up the temp a bit?
Always use a winter front when traveling in the cold... Gas, diesel or whatever... It doesn't take long for fuel lines to gel... I'm not sure what its like in the US, but in Canada, the gas stations will switch to a winter blend of Diesel to prevent gelling... I believe that the switch occurs as soon as temps start dropping to < 32F... Carry a bottle of diesel anti-gel with you (but check to see what Cummins recommends).. You may want to make sure and run down your tank of diesel that you've bought in warmer climates (once again this comes from sheer ignorance of how things work in your home area), and fill up once you hit the snow belt...
Rod
Q: In cool and cold weather, my voltmeter jumps up and down. Is a belt slipping?
[ul][*]When the temperature is below 59 degrees, the intake manifold heater cycles to warm the air entering the cylinders. The heaters draw more current than the alternator can produce when running, so the voltmeter sees the heaters drag down the voltage. Cycling may continue for several minutes in cold weather.[*]Intake manifold heater cycles depend on the temperature of the manifold.[*]Post heat time sepends on how quickly the manifold temperature sensor warms to 59 F [/ul]
Intake Manifold Temp
Pre-Heat Cycle Time Ignition on, Engine Not Running
Post-Heat Cycle Ignition On, Engine Running
Above 59 F (15 C)
0 Seconds (no heat)
No
15 F to 59 F (-10 C to 15 C)
10 Seconds
Yes
0 F to 15 F (-18 C to -10 C)
15 Seconds
Yes
Below 0 F (-18 C) /td>
30 Seconds
Yes
Q: Will the diesel start in subzero weather?
[ul][*]The Cummins B will reliably start at temperatures to -20 degrees F without the block heater, but the engine is much happier if the block heater is used. It may take several manifold heat/start cycles before the engine fires and continues to run. Expect a large smoke cloud, engine and accessory whine, knocking, and vibration until things warm.[*]Below -20, some block heat is usually needed to get the engine to reliably fire. Always allow the oil to warm before using heavy throttle or running the engine above 2000 rpm. An electrically operated magnetic oil pan heater will help warm the oil and make the engine easier to turn over. Espar makes diesel fired block heaters for people who can't plug the truck into an electrical outlet. In cold weather Cummins Premium Blue 2000 semi-synthetic engine oil flows better than regular 15W-40, but it does not have the required SF or SG rating!. [/ul]
Q: Why Can't I use ether as a cold weather starting aid?
[ul][*]Ether is highly flammable and can be ignited by the intake manifold heater grid, causing engine damage or operator injury. [/ul]
Q: Should an additive be used in the fuel to keep it from clogging the fuel system?
[ul][*]Below 15 degrees F, wax crystals begin to form in diesel fuel. These crystals form a gell that will clog the fuel filter or fuel lines and stop the engine as the temperature drops toward 0 F. Any good "winter fuel conditioner" for diesel fuel will keep the fuel moving to at least -20 degrees. Follow the instructions on the bottle! [/ul]
Q: How can I tell when the fuel begins to gell?
[ul][*]The first hint is often an unstable idle. The idle speed may increase to 1000 rpm or more and fluctuate slowly. Next the engine will begin to lose power. Within a few minutes the engine will quit and not restart or will only restart briefly. [/ul]
Q: What can I do if the fuel has already gelled due to the cold?
[ul][*]The time proven remedy is to add a gallon of kerosene for each 10 to 20 gallons of fuel to the tank, then allow it to sit long enough for the kerosene to diffuse into the fuel. In weather below -20 degrees F, one gallon of kerosene for 10 gallons of fuel will keep things moving, but fuel economy will be reduced. Kerosene now has red dye which a DOT inspector will assume is off-road diesel. Be prepared for a hassle if you are checked.[*]Apply heat to the fuel filter to break up the wax. [/ul]
[align=center]Cold Weather Hints[/align]
From a 1995 issue of the Star Center News
By following the cold weather operating procedures in the Owners Manual, you will be able to reduce white smoke, improve cold weather starting performance, and maximize fuel burn efficiency in the combustion chamber.
The engine block heater usage is recommended as follows:
1) With temperatures above 40 deg F, the block heater is not needed.
2) With temperatures between 40 deg F and 0 deg F, the block heater is suggested.
3) With temperatures below 0 deg F, the block heater is required.
From: Drdonnelly <Drdonnelly@aol.com>
To: ramtruck
when it gets really cold and you can't plug in, cycle the grid heater twice.
Warming up a diesel is funny. When the air is really cold, it hardly heats enough to burn the fuel that is injected. Letting it sit and idle only makes it worse, as the chamber temp does not rise much. Most of the fuel energy does work (runs the engine), and the poor thing can't warm up. You gotta load it some to get some waste heat in the exhaust and water jackets. However, you can't load it too much because it can't burn all that fuel, and you just wash the cylinder walls and puke out white smoke (unburned fuel).
I start mine, let it run maybe 30 seconds to get oil pressure and then a bit of time after the gauge comes up. Then I drive gently for a bit--downhill grade is OK. Just get a bit of time on it with very light load--moving the truck gently is enough. After a couple to several minutes when it is just beginning to know it is running, put on a little more load...climb a hill taking it kinda easy, or something. I try to keep egt down to say 600 max at this point (in the manifold). Pretty soon, the water temp gauge will budge and your battle is over. The giant has awakened and is ready for work.
Now I know the above is "extreme" babying of the engine in a way. But, it works and is as close to optimum as I can come up with in the real world. One thing is for sure--don't start it and idle for 5 minutes at the house. That will clog the catalytic converter and coke up the injectors because the fuel can't flash off them completely. You're much better off loading it just enough to keep egt at or just above 300 degrees.
As for the aftercooler, partially blocking the radiator does little to help when the thermostat is closed, but it will help the engine get warmer air in the cylinders. The intercooler (really an aftercoooler) will only cool the intake air too much at this point if you don't partially block it when the engine is frigid.
Joe
Subject: Re: DiRT: Cummins Winter Prep Questions
From: "Rod Snaith" <snaith.farms@sk.sympatico.ca>
To: DiRT
> do you find that the Ram keeps everyone's toes warm
> when running down the highway in sub-zero stuff? Or does anyone put
> any type of cover over the radiator to up the temp a bit?
Always use a winter front when traveling in the cold... Gas, diesel or whatever... It doesn't take long for fuel lines to gel... I'm not sure what its like in the US, but in Canada, the gas stations will switch to a winter blend of Diesel to prevent gelling... I believe that the switch occurs as soon as temps start dropping to < 32F... Carry a bottle of diesel anti-gel with you (but check to see what Cummins recommends).. You may want to make sure and run down your tank of diesel that you've bought in warmer climates (once again this comes from sheer ignorance of how things work in your home area), and fill up once you hit the snow belt...
Rod
#15
RE: Cold weather warm-up/idle time?
If I'm going to let mine idle for a couple minutes I flip on the exhaust brake, but usually I just put it in first and idle out, slip her in second without touching the throttle and just idle out to the street. Don't really need the go pedal to get to 5th and I'll just go down the street at 20 or whatever 1200 RPM in 5th is. It take a couple minutes to get to the freeway, so when I get there it still isn't warm so I just putz down the on ramp and use the slight downhill to grab 6th without taking the rpm up past 1500. Then I just putz along at like 50 until the engine starts to warm up and the oil pressure drops down to normal. I still won't bring the RPM over 2k or run any boost until the truck is up to operating temp. That's just what I do, I don't know if that is the right thing or not, but the truck seems to like it. Anyone know if letting it idle with the exhaust brake is bad? I always figured it was good cuz it put that light load on the engine.
#16
#20
RE: Cold weather warm-up/idle time?
Q: Why Can't I use ether as a cold weather starting aid?
[ul][*]Ether is highly flammable and can be ignited by the intake manifold heater grid, causing engine damage or operator injury. [/ul]I always wondered why we were warned not to use it, yet the mechanics in the yards carry it around in holsters during the winter.
[ul][*]Ether is highly flammable and can be ignited by the intake manifold heater grid, causing engine damage or operator injury. [/ul]I always wondered why we were warned not to use it, yet the mechanics in the yards carry it around in holsters during the winter.