97 B2500 3.9l Starting
#1
02-19-2009, 10:46 AM
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97 B2500 3.9l Starting
97' full conversion, Intemittent starting. Cranks fine, new cap & rotor.
After several turns of the key it will finally start and stay's running, never stalls.
Have under hood fuse compartment and yesterday swapped asd, fuel pump, A/C, relays to see if it would help. This morning same symptom. This time I turmed the Key several times until I heard the fuel pump then it started right up. For the last 4 days it starts fine after the 1st hard start and will start all day long.
I have read other posts on the net that there may be a splicing/corrosion problem under the hood. Have also read about the crank sensor issues.
As the car remains running and only has starting issue could this just be a short.
After several turns of the key it will finally start and stay's running, never stalls.
Have under hood fuse compartment and yesterday swapped asd, fuel pump, A/C, relays to see if it would help. This morning same symptom. This time I turmed the Key several times until I heard the fuel pump then it started right up. For the last 4 days it starts fine after the 1st hard start and will start all day long.
I have read other posts on the net that there may be a splicing/corrosion problem under the hood. Have also read about the crank sensor issues.
As the car remains running and only has starting issue could this just be a short.
#2
02-19-2009, 12:00 PM
This could be a sign of a worn out fuel pump. After sitting for a while it could be a bit lazy until it spins for the first time and loosens up a bit. You might want to try checking the fuel pressure during the first start attempt of the day. Then check it later in the day and compare the results.
#3
02-23-2009, 08:22 PM
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Follow up.
Thanks for your advice. I did spend several hours checking sensors, wires, PCM, to make sure the whole system was up to par. I'll be spending about 250 dollars for the pump assembly tomorrow.
Advice to others:
The tank drop wasn't too bad. Rather then fight the long rusty bolts, I used a small pair of bolt cutters to cut the rear bolts off the 2 front to rear straps. Then the strap that goes from left to right still is plenty to hold a tank with about 1/4 or less of fuel (35 Gal tank with 3 straps under the rear end).
Then place a jack under the tank with a board to support it and unscrew the last hanger about 1" then just lift the bolt to unhook it.
I removed the fuel filler pipe with the tank. I was trying to make as little vapor exposure. Having done the trickery of getting the thing down with the tube, I should have gone and and just removed the 2" rubber junction with the hose clamps.
I have been in Automotive Managment for 20 years for various parts suppliers including one that made the fuel strainers for Dakotas. My most recent employment, managing the assembly of the entire instrument panel for the Sebring & Avenger.
I would have thought with my experience, just replacing the pump itself would be no problem. Trust me, I disassembled the unit completely and would not recommend saving anything. Hoses become stiff, filters dirty, electrical connections are not the greatest.
Don't wait, my pump started acting up last week and now is completely dead, I confirmed this with a bench test. I was lucky enough to have it fail at home, in the garage, less then 1/4 tank of gas. The way I look at it, I saved myself a Tow and $$$ for it.
Advice to others:
The tank drop wasn't too bad. Rather then fight the long rusty bolts, I used a small pair of bolt cutters to cut the rear bolts off the 2 front to rear straps. Then the strap that goes from left to right still is plenty to hold a tank with about 1/4 or less of fuel (35 Gal tank with 3 straps under the rear end).
Then place a jack under the tank with a board to support it and unscrew the last hanger about 1" then just lift the bolt to unhook it.
I removed the fuel filler pipe with the tank. I was trying to make as little vapor exposure. Having done the trickery of getting the thing down with the tube, I should have gone and and just removed the 2" rubber junction with the hose clamps.
I have been in Automotive Managment for 20 years for various parts suppliers including one that made the fuel strainers for Dakotas. My most recent employment, managing the assembly of the entire instrument panel for the Sebring & Avenger.
I would have thought with my experience, just replacing the pump itself would be no problem. Trust me, I disassembled the unit completely and would not recommend saving anything. Hoses become stiff, filters dirty, electrical connections are not the greatest.
Don't wait, my pump started acting up last week and now is completely dead, I confirmed this with a bench test. I was lucky enough to have it fail at home, in the garage, less then 1/4 tank of gas. The way I look at it, I saved myself a Tow and $$$ for it.
#5
03-04-2009, 03:28 PM
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Update
The fuel pump is installed. My final discovery, when I went to prime the pump by triggering the fuel relay - it would not run... I checked the green / black from the front of the car to the pump, it was good. I checked the ground to chassis and got about 300 ohms. I took a chance and cut the ground about 12' from the pump and ran my own ground. The pump worked.
Other discovery, beneath the right rear tail lamp (in the cab) the harness exits through the floor. The sealing grommet came loose and the connector for the harness dropped out the hole exposing the connector to the outside. The terminals had corroded, and a couple wires broke free when I put it back in place.
Do you know if the ground for the pump ties into other ground wires in this connector? Could I have been pulling higher current through a poor ground causing the failure of the pump?
I have connected my own ground up to the block as I didn't want to take a chance on the old ground. The van runs fine now.
I have a Chiltons service book, but it only shows ground going to chassis. Can anyone confirm if the ground for the fuel pump joins up with other grounds at the rear of the vehicle?
Is there a circuit Diagram online could look at -97 b2500.
Other discovery, beneath the right rear tail lamp (in the cab) the harness exits through the floor. The sealing grommet came loose and the connector for the harness dropped out the hole exposing the connector to the outside. The terminals had corroded, and a couple wires broke free when I put it back in place.
Do you know if the ground for the pump ties into other ground wires in this connector? Could I have been pulling higher current through a poor ground causing the failure of the pump?
I have connected my own ground up to the block as I didn't want to take a chance on the old ground. The van runs fine now.
I have a Chiltons service book, but it only shows ground going to chassis. Can anyone confirm if the ground for the fuel pump joins up with other grounds at the rear of the vehicle?
Is there a circuit Diagram online could look at -97 b2500.
#6
03-04-2009, 08:12 PM
Record Breaker
What diagram are you looking for? I should be able to help with that.
The ground point at the Right Tail lamp inside on the floor that you described is where the fuel pump ground connects to. If you repaired this ground point and reattached it to the floor (or even the door jam) you should restore all the components that ground there. The following components are:
Lt/Rt Tail Lamps
Lt/Rt Turn/Stop Lamps
Backup Lamps
License Plate Lamp
Fuel Pump
The ground point at the Right Tail lamp inside on the floor that you described is where the fuel pump ground connects to. If you repaired this ground point and reattached it to the floor (or even the door jam) you should restore all the components that ground there. The following components are:
Lt/Rt Tail Lamps
Lt/Rt Turn/Stop Lamps
Backup Lamps
License Plate Lamp
Fuel Pump