Drilled & Slotted Rotors
#21
02-20-2006, 06:19 AM
RE: Drilled & Slotted Rotors
gmansrt10 may be closer to the truth than you care to hear.
I've heard this argument from racers I trust as well.
It was put to me more like this:
Drilled rotors become an advantage when you run your car at the extremes, as the gas buildup will not occur under moderate (normal) driving, only under high temp conditions like when I turn my rotors bright orange after several laps at the track.
With slotted/ drilled, you will still see some benefit in wet weather for water dissipation, it is minimal. Instead, you surrender 5-10% of the surface area your pads come in contact with thanks to the removed material (holes slots or both) your braking efficiency decreases by the same 5-10%.
This is merely a question of WHERE you plan on running your car. On the street, consider solid rotors, or slotted at best. On the track, do what gets you the best times around the course, and pay the price for lesser response on the streets.
Performance cars come with them for a few reasons, one is that the rotors are already Way oversized (Something we Strat owners don’t have the luxury of), to compensate for the loss, and second is that they are marketing the car to both the “extreme”, and “young” crowd.
Face it…. Looks sell, even if it is a step backwards in true performance. And to the dealer, the dollar rules all marketing decisions.
2 cents
Vince
I've heard this argument from racers I trust as well.
It was put to me more like this:
Drilled rotors become an advantage when you run your car at the extremes, as the gas buildup will not occur under moderate (normal) driving, only under high temp conditions like when I turn my rotors bright orange after several laps at the track.
With slotted/ drilled, you will still see some benefit in wet weather for water dissipation, it is minimal. Instead, you surrender 5-10% of the surface area your pads come in contact with thanks to the removed material (holes slots or both) your braking efficiency decreases by the same 5-10%.
This is merely a question of WHERE you plan on running your car. On the street, consider solid rotors, or slotted at best. On the track, do what gets you the best times around the course, and pay the price for lesser response on the streets.
Performance cars come with them for a few reasons, one is that the rotors are already Way oversized (Something we Strat owners don’t have the luxury of), to compensate for the loss, and second is that they are marketing the car to both the “extreme”, and “young” crowd.
Face it…. Looks sell, even if it is a step backwards in true performance. And to the dealer, the dollar rules all marketing decisions.
2 cents
Vince
#22
02-20-2006, 12:30 PM
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RE: Drilled & Slotted Rotors
ORIGINAL: B_52
gmansrt10 may be closer to the truth than you care to hear.
I've heard this argument from racers I trust as well.
It was put to me more like this:
Drilled rotors become an advantage when you run your car at the extremes, as the gas buildup will not occur under moderate (normal) driving, only under high temp conditions like when I turn my rotors bright orange after several laps at the track.
With slotted/ drilled, you will still see some benefit in wet weather for water dissipation, it is minimal. Instead, you surrender 5-10% of the surface area your pads come in contact with thanks to the removed material (holes slots or both) your braking efficiency decreases by the same 5-10%.
This is merely a question of WHERE you plan on running your car. On the street, consider solid rotors, or slotted at best. On the track, do what gets you the best times around the course, and pay the price for lesser response on the streets.
Performance cars come with them for a few reasons, one is that the rotors are already Way oversized (Something we Strat owners don’t have the luxury of), to compensate for the loss, and second is that they are marketing the car to both the “extreme”, and “young” crowd.
Face it…. Looks sell, even if it is a step backwards in true performance. And to the dealer, the dollar rules all marketing decisions.
2 cents
Vince
gmansrt10 may be closer to the truth than you care to hear.
I've heard this argument from racers I trust as well.
It was put to me more like this:
Drilled rotors become an advantage when you run your car at the extremes, as the gas buildup will not occur under moderate (normal) driving, only under high temp conditions like when I turn my rotors bright orange after several laps at the track.
With slotted/ drilled, you will still see some benefit in wet weather for water dissipation, it is minimal. Instead, you surrender 5-10% of the surface area your pads come in contact with thanks to the removed material (holes slots or both) your braking efficiency decreases by the same 5-10%.
This is merely a question of WHERE you plan on running your car. On the street, consider solid rotors, or slotted at best. On the track, do what gets you the best times around the course, and pay the price for lesser response on the streets.
Performance cars come with them for a few reasons, one is that the rotors are already Way oversized (Something we Strat owners don’t have the luxury of), to compensate for the loss, and second is that they are marketing the car to both the “extreme”, and “young” crowd.
Face it…. Looks sell, even if it is a step backwards in true performance. And to the dealer, the dollar rules all marketing decisions.
2 cents
Vince
Also, I'll take my chances over the stock OEM rotors....they're crap...I dont like them on any DCX vehicle I've owned....and my stepdad is hopefully changing his out soon as well. He's started to complain about his also.
EDIT:
Entirely too many of the newer sporty cars are coming with them or have the aftermarket parts coming with them. I simply cannot believe that there isnt something to it at all. There's got to be a reason why they're doing it besides money, because if it was as bad as you are making it out to be, no one would buy them. I just feel like someone's missing the positives and only showing the "negatives", as so to speak.
#23
02-20-2006, 02:28 PM
RE: Drilled & Slotted Rotors
the almighty dollar is what is leading me to buy them...160 for 4, or 150 for two? ive put about 1000 miles on my car in the last year, so im willing to take my chances..vince, while i agree that you have a valid point, and good support to your points, i believe that if anything, the benefits cancel out the downfalls...i have less braking surface, but they still do technically disperse heat (and water) more quickly...not to mention the fac tthat they look better, and are much cheaper.
#24
02-21-2006, 01:55 AM
RE: Drilled & Slotted Rotors
Performance cars come with them because even though minimal people do take there cars to the track they were designed for racing use. The reason they sell is honestly just because of the looks, and I agree I love the look but I wont sacrifice performance for looks. There are many aspects of the aftermarket that are very falsely represented. Our cars really can not generate that heat unless you are really beating it to the extremes. Im tellin you the truth.
#25
02-21-2006, 02:23 AM
RE: Drilled & Slotted Rotors
but, every braking system generates heat, and anything that disperses heat, at all, will help. the amount of surface area lost is minimal and if anything, the gaps would cause some extra friction...this arguement is pointless..its like saying "a regular car cant benefit from very high performance tires if the car cant go fast enough to need them", but in the long run, high performance tires are better then, say, kelly chargers. anything that helps disperse heat, even if only 1 degree, is technically helping.
and my car is beaten to the extreme non-stop. which is why in 50,000 miles, ive had to fix nothing except for tires, motor mounts, and 5 sets of ceramic pads. my car has been autocrossed, and frequently taken to the drag strip...and while i take Very good care of my car, it wears the "road and track" badge, and it is used accordingly.
and as much as i love my car, if it was performance that you were hunting for, you bought the wrong car...i bought mine because i have low 12 second car in the garage, and i needed a nice, fairly quick daily driver.
and my car is beaten to the extreme non-stop. which is why in 50,000 miles, ive had to fix nothing except for tires, motor mounts, and 5 sets of ceramic pads. my car has been autocrossed, and frequently taken to the drag strip...and while i take Very good care of my car, it wears the "road and track" badge, and it is used accordingly.
I wont sacrifice performance for looks.
#26
02-22-2006, 12:51 AM
RE: Drilled & Slotted Rotors
Look the rotors are simply a friction are and heat sink when you take away area you are reducing heat sink material and friction surface. There is NO benefit only disadvantages to drilled and slotted rotors on a daily driver. And ceramic pads are terrible for modern rotors. There is no argument here...do the research. I didnt buy the car as a performance car but drilled and slotted rotors still sacrifices the perfromance that the car does have.
#27
02-22-2006, 12:53 AM
#28
02-22-2006, 01:15 AM
RE: Drilled & Slotted Rotors
wow...im impressed, and i feel silly for stating what i thought. a shame that they didnt have a four week grammar seminar.
so, youre saying that in 4 weeks, you learned and retained, everything that there is to know about braking systems? as proud as i am of your instructor, i have known plenty of people who had ASE certs, and were complete morons. i worked with one who couldnt do a drum brake job to save his soul. i would appreciate if you could find me some documentation on this fact of slotted rotors being so awful?
and ceramic pads are awful for modern rotors? then why do SO MANY cars (predominantly imports) come stock with ceramic pads? i eagerly look forward to your reply on this one...while i dont have 4 weeks of instruction, when i worked as a tech, i did have a computer, and the system required us to replace OEM ceramic pads with ceramic pads...so im curious how they are so awful.
so, youre saying that in 4 weeks, you learned and retained, everything that there is to know about braking systems? as proud as i am of your instructor, i have known plenty of people who had ASE certs, and were complete morons. i worked with one who couldnt do a drum brake job to save his soul. i would appreciate if you could find me some documentation on this fact of slotted rotors being so awful?
and ceramic pads are awful for modern rotors? then why do SO MANY cars (predominantly imports) come stock with ceramic pads? i eagerly look forward to your reply on this one...while i dont have 4 weeks of instruction, when i worked as a tech, i did have a computer, and the system required us to replace OEM ceramic pads with ceramic pads...so im curious how they are so awful.
#29
02-22-2006, 01:52 AM
RE: Drilled & Slotted Rotors
Im trying to share good info here. All my info is published in a text book from the school but I wont photo copy that cause its pointless. The info I stated is also common sense. And ASE certified techs arent idiots they passed tests that you and I dont have the knowledge to some just arent hands on. But my instructor was a master tech and he was even a certified Viper technician for Country Dodge in Lancaster Pennsylvania. Ive always read that ceramic pads can easily score rotors but thats up for argument I just threw that out there.
#30
02-22-2006, 01:59 AM
RE: Drilled & Slotted Rotors
Which school would that be??? I want to sign up for a four week class. You are right brake rotors are sources of friction and act as a heat sink. The heat and gasses produced during braking are removed by the cross drilling and slotting. the slotting also acts as a friction enhancer working like a micro shaver helping keep the pads worn flat also aiding in keeping better contact between pad and rotor. Cross drilled and slotted rotors of past were prone to cracking around the slots. the key to limit the chances of warping or cracking is to properly season the rotors. Now as for ceramic pads you say they are so bad and worthless but yet offer no alternative.