New Neon owner here !
#1
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Hi everybody, I just bought a 1996 Plymouth Neon "expresso" 2 door with 51 k miles on it and with a 5 speed manual. I formerly owned a 95 Ford Escort but the motor blew on it with 75 k miles on the clock. Anyways this car will be my new daily driver and Id like to improve on a few things.
My goals for it are the following:
I want to give the car a bit more power and maybe a high 15 second 1/4 mile capability while still running on 87 octane and getting gas miliage comperable to stock and itll need to be smogged every two years.
I want to really improve on the handling characteristics of the car.. more so then the acceloration.
It will have a full stereo system in it including subbox and amp which obviously will make attaining the two previously stated goals slightly more difficult.
What I am currently looking at, and Id like some comments suggestions criticisms ect are basically exaust and intake improvements. Maybe a header, aftermarket cat, muffler ect as well as a cold air intake system. I also am thinking about a underdrive pulley set up of some sort but am worried that the alternator might not get charged enough for my stereo. For suspension Id probably first get aluminium aftermarket wheels of some type, decent low profile tires, lowering springs ect.
My goals for it are the following:
I want to give the car a bit more power and maybe a high 15 second 1/4 mile capability while still running on 87 octane and getting gas miliage comperable to stock and itll need to be smogged every two years.
I want to really improve on the handling characteristics of the car.. more so then the acceloration.
It will have a full stereo system in it including subbox and amp which obviously will make attaining the two previously stated goals slightly more difficult.
What I am currently looking at, and Id like some comments suggestions criticisms ect are basically exaust and intake improvements. Maybe a header, aftermarket cat, muffler ect as well as a cold air intake system. I also am thinking about a underdrive pulley set up of some sort but am worried that the alternator might not get charged enough for my stereo. For suspension Id probably first get aluminium aftermarket wheels of some type, decent low profile tires, lowering springs ect.
#2
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The Expresso only had the SOHC in '96, right? Even so, you should be pretty close to your high 15's goal already. I was there with nothing more than a warm air intake, straight-through muffler, and UDP on cheap Wal-Mart tires...
I wouldn't bother with "lowering" springs. The Neon already has a very small amount of travel as it is (about 3"). Lowering the car puts you closer to the bump stops, which means you'll need stiffer springs to keep you from bouncing off them and destroying the stock struts. Problem is, most of the lowering springs are progressive rate and never get stiff enough to do any good. My car handled worse with KYB's and Eibach Pro's than with the stock Highline suspension... Mopar makes a linear rate spring, but even the High Rate is too stiff for the valving on the stock struts and will blow them fairly quickly. You can get better struts though. Forget the KYB GR-2's, they are valved the same as the stock (R/T, base) struts... Koni's (adjustable rebound/jounce, slotted for adjustable camber, same units that are on the '96-'99 ACR) are much better suited for the higher rate springs, even the Mopar X-Highs. But for the price you'd pay for a new set of Konis ($700 or so) and new Mopar Springs ($125 or so), you are easily within reach of true coilovers. www.phantomhp.com has K-Sport coilovers for 1st gens at $950. These are height adjustable, rebound/jounce adjustable (single ****), camber adjustable (camber plates up front), and valved properly for the springs that come with them (a little higher than the Mopar X-Highs). The real question is, how stiff of a ride are you willing to deal with? The Koni/High Rate (225/185 lbs/in front/rear) combo is acceptable for most people, but substantially stiffer than what you are used to now (140/120 lb/in front/rear). The Mopar X-Highs are seriously stiff (310/230) and may be a bit harsh for family members... The K-Sports are even stiffer (forget the rates at the moment), but you could get aftermarket springs for them do bring the rates down to a little less than the X-Highs without needeing to revalve the strut portion (which no one has done yet...). The K-Sport option is by far the most cost effective setup for a competetive suspension. The Koni/High Rate would be considered the minimum acceptable to be competitive, but makes for a nicer daily drive.
For sway bars, your car should have the smaller front bar (20mm) and no rear bar. You can upgrade to just the stock R/T or ACR parts fairly easily (22mm front, 16mm rear), just need the brackets for the back, although aftermarket dogbones from www.deyemeracing.com are much better than the stock units, which have a tendency to break. Mopar makes a slightly adjustable (multiple attachment points) rear 22mm bar which is pretty nice, but if you put it on the "stiff" setting, be prepared for oversteer city... Many people have gone to an Eibach front and Mopar rear, and Vitor (www.neongoodies.net) is selling a monster swaybar set that looks very promising. Remember, springs are the primary way to reduce body roll. Sway bars are the primary way to balance handling (oversteer/understeer). Fine tuning can be done with tire pressures and strut valving adjustments.
The lightest wheels I've seen for the Neon are the SSR Competitions. The 15x7" weigh in at like 8 pounds or something ridiculous, but run $300+ per wheel... There's an SSR knockoff called NZO (Monza Lights?) that weigh a little more, but are a lot cheaper. The Kosei K1 Racing 15" wheel is much more affordable than the SSR's and still pretty light. I went ultra cheap, Pep Boys 14x6" alloys weighing in a full pound each under the stock 14" alloys for $200 (set of 4). "Low profile" tires are a bit overrated. 15" for the Neon seems to be the best compromise between weight, cost, tire selection (and cost), and handling. Going bigger doesn't handle any better, just weighs more... If you want to put really low profile track rubber on there for autocross, I'm with ya! Only reason I went from my stock 13's to 14's was tire selection. I chose the Yokohama AVS ES100's over the Falken Azenis Sports simply for wet weather traction, and love them. If I'd gone with 15's, I would have gone with a better tire since there's a much better selection...
Poly suspension bushings aren't that expensive any more. Think I paid $210 back when I was first getting into this, now the set is like $80... Worth every penny though. And that about wraps it up for handling...
If you are not planning for super HP, then we won't get into the whole engine building stuff. Bolt-on's will get you deep into the 15's and fairly easily into the 14's, even with the added weight of a stereo system. My site is way outdated (and incorrect at times), but take a gander if you don't mind... http://pages.cthome.net/rader/disclaimer.html Basically, you've got the right idea. I just expound on it a little more. The 1st gen SOHC is plenty capable of 175-180 HP, which means 150 HP to the wheels, give or take, with just bolt-on's. Keep in mind, I consider the camshaft a bolt-on... If you live in a state where they actually open the hood, check all the parts, and ask for EPA certificates for all your aftermarket goodies, it'll be a little harder. If all they do is a sniffer and look for a cat, you're set.
You can usually find a higher output alternator on ebay. Pretty sure Autozone can even get one. If you end up going with an underdrive pulley, you may want to consider an alternator overdrive pulley to compensate. Deyeme Racing has them from time-to-time. Haven't checked their site in a while. While you're there, be sure to look at their motor mounts. And www.boogerracing.com sells a rear bobble strut that will pretty much eliminate wheel hop, if you can stand the extra vibration in the car...
Hope that's enough to get you started. Best of luck!
I wouldn't bother with "lowering" springs. The Neon already has a very small amount of travel as it is (about 3"). Lowering the car puts you closer to the bump stops, which means you'll need stiffer springs to keep you from bouncing off them and destroying the stock struts. Problem is, most of the lowering springs are progressive rate and never get stiff enough to do any good. My car handled worse with KYB's and Eibach Pro's than with the stock Highline suspension... Mopar makes a linear rate spring, but even the High Rate is too stiff for the valving on the stock struts and will blow them fairly quickly. You can get better struts though. Forget the KYB GR-2's, they are valved the same as the stock (R/T, base) struts... Koni's (adjustable rebound/jounce, slotted for adjustable camber, same units that are on the '96-'99 ACR) are much better suited for the higher rate springs, even the Mopar X-Highs. But for the price you'd pay for a new set of Konis ($700 or so) and new Mopar Springs ($125 or so), you are easily within reach of true coilovers. www.phantomhp.com has K-Sport coilovers for 1st gens at $950. These are height adjustable, rebound/jounce adjustable (single ****), camber adjustable (camber plates up front), and valved properly for the springs that come with them (a little higher than the Mopar X-Highs). The real question is, how stiff of a ride are you willing to deal with? The Koni/High Rate (225/185 lbs/in front/rear) combo is acceptable for most people, but substantially stiffer than what you are used to now (140/120 lb/in front/rear). The Mopar X-Highs are seriously stiff (310/230) and may be a bit harsh for family members... The K-Sports are even stiffer (forget the rates at the moment), but you could get aftermarket springs for them do bring the rates down to a little less than the X-Highs without needeing to revalve the strut portion (which no one has done yet...). The K-Sport option is by far the most cost effective setup for a competetive suspension. The Koni/High Rate would be considered the minimum acceptable to be competitive, but makes for a nicer daily drive.
For sway bars, your car should have the smaller front bar (20mm) and no rear bar. You can upgrade to just the stock R/T or ACR parts fairly easily (22mm front, 16mm rear), just need the brackets for the back, although aftermarket dogbones from www.deyemeracing.com are much better than the stock units, which have a tendency to break. Mopar makes a slightly adjustable (multiple attachment points) rear 22mm bar which is pretty nice, but if you put it on the "stiff" setting, be prepared for oversteer city... Many people have gone to an Eibach front and Mopar rear, and Vitor (www.neongoodies.net) is selling a monster swaybar set that looks very promising. Remember, springs are the primary way to reduce body roll. Sway bars are the primary way to balance handling (oversteer/understeer). Fine tuning can be done with tire pressures and strut valving adjustments.
The lightest wheels I've seen for the Neon are the SSR Competitions. The 15x7" weigh in at like 8 pounds or something ridiculous, but run $300+ per wheel... There's an SSR knockoff called NZO (Monza Lights?) that weigh a little more, but are a lot cheaper. The Kosei K1 Racing 15" wheel is much more affordable than the SSR's and still pretty light. I went ultra cheap, Pep Boys 14x6" alloys weighing in a full pound each under the stock 14" alloys for $200 (set of 4). "Low profile" tires are a bit overrated. 15" for the Neon seems to be the best compromise between weight, cost, tire selection (and cost), and handling. Going bigger doesn't handle any better, just weighs more... If you want to put really low profile track rubber on there for autocross, I'm with ya! Only reason I went from my stock 13's to 14's was tire selection. I chose the Yokohama AVS ES100's over the Falken Azenis Sports simply for wet weather traction, and love them. If I'd gone with 15's, I would have gone with a better tire since there's a much better selection...
Poly suspension bushings aren't that expensive any more. Think I paid $210 back when I was first getting into this, now the set is like $80... Worth every penny though. And that about wraps it up for handling...
If you are not planning for super HP, then we won't get into the whole engine building stuff. Bolt-on's will get you deep into the 15's and fairly easily into the 14's, even with the added weight of a stereo system. My site is way outdated (and incorrect at times), but take a gander if you don't mind... http://pages.cthome.net/rader/disclaimer.html Basically, you've got the right idea. I just expound on it a little more. The 1st gen SOHC is plenty capable of 175-180 HP, which means 150 HP to the wheels, give or take, with just bolt-on's. Keep in mind, I consider the camshaft a bolt-on... If you live in a state where they actually open the hood, check all the parts, and ask for EPA certificates for all your aftermarket goodies, it'll be a little harder. If all they do is a sniffer and look for a cat, you're set.
You can usually find a higher output alternator on ebay. Pretty sure Autozone can even get one. If you end up going with an underdrive pulley, you may want to consider an alternator overdrive pulley to compensate. Deyeme Racing has them from time-to-time. Haven't checked their site in a while. While you're there, be sure to look at their motor mounts. And www.boogerracing.com sells a rear bobble strut that will pretty much eliminate wheel hop, if you can stand the extra vibration in the car...
Hope that's enough to get you started. Best of luck!
#3
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If you wanna compete or have semi-superloud system .....the lanzar optidrive series amps, components,and subs, are all pure power and wont break the bank, the reason I like em is the fact that they are lighter stacked magnet and ohm capabilty of the amps...oh and they are straight competition...they pound and are very high power ...If ugot udp you will need the alternator upgraded or a blue or yellow topped battery...my one 12 inch jl sets off my battery light under a load when ran at night cuz all my lights are on...and I have unorthodox UDP...i will eventually do the upgrade on battery but could care less for the price. Lanzar- everything else- just sucks and you will commonly hear that in audio forums. All the equip..works well together so you wont need to mix and match diff. brands. Remember OPTI D (drive) and welcome to the forums...
#4
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Hmmm wow, I do have alot to learn here about these cars. I dont think I want to have all out competitive suspension for autocross or anything like that. Just something thats got a tolerable ride on the street but still might pull like .90+ Gs on a skid pad.. Maybe Id probably be best with the Koni stuts and the mopar high rate springs since I dont want an all out race car just a really tight car for the road. Before Id do anything like that Id probably just change the wheels/tires and drive it for awhile like that since I still do have to get a feel for the car. 15 inches sounds about right looking at the car but Id have to look at different styles to find the wheels I want.
I dont plan on having a competitive stereo system that blows my ear drums out, I just have a 600 watt amp with 2 10 inch subs. So Id guess I wouldnt need the alternator overdrive right?
I live in Cali. where they smog cars on a dyno and they check under the hood. I was looking at some aftermarket headers and CAI online and some of them say 50 state smog legal so I think Id be ok. As for a cam.. well maybe if and when the head gasket blows on the motor ( i know these things are prone to that) Id swap the stock cam out for something slightly more potent, of course it would have to be smog legal or at least not make the car pollute too much more.
Thanks for the advice.
I dont plan on having a competitive stereo system that blows my ear drums out, I just have a 600 watt amp with 2 10 inch subs. So Id guess I wouldnt need the alternator overdrive right?
I live in Cali. where they smog cars on a dyno and they check under the hood. I was looking at some aftermarket headers and CAI online and some of them say 50 state smog legal so I think Id be ok. As for a cam.. well maybe if and when the head gasket blows on the motor ( i know these things are prone to that) Id swap the stock cam out for something slightly more potent, of course it would have to be smog legal or at least not make the car pollute too much more.
Thanks for the advice.
#5
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#7
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I don't recall what the offset is on the SRT-4. If it's 40mm, they should fit, they're only 17x6"... The tires from an SRT-4 won't fit though...
A stock 1st gen ACR will pull over 1G on the skidpad stock. So The Mopar springs with a stock R/T sway setup isn't going to hurt any... Remember though, stiffer sways will reduce total traction in a turn, I wouldn't go any bigger than those.
A stock 1st gen ACR will pull over 1G on the skidpad stock. So The Mopar springs with a stock R/T sway setup isn't going to hurt any... Remember though, stiffer sways will reduce total traction in a turn, I wouldn't go any bigger than those.
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#8
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Wow well 1 full G would be more then enough to satisfy me, thats Viper, Ferrari and Z06 territory ! Later down the line ill probably go with a set up somewhat like that. I did look into those SRT-4 wheels and once I realized they were 17 inches I gave that idea some second thought. Ill probably go with some kind of clean 8 spoke wheels either gun metal black or polished aluminium looking. I dont want to go super low profile with the tires either, I want at least like 3 inches of side wall.