Theres a reason why I only have addressed 03neonr/t and nobody else. I'm not stupid, I understand when somebody is actually lagitimately trying to help me out and give me some nice tips and critcism. I understand not everybody is going to dig my car, I'm down with that.. I know when somebody is trying to be a jerk, I can just read your responses R/T and tell your being a dick just the way you talk, as if your almost getting irritated as you write your post, and I don't appreciate it at all. Personally, I would enjoy your opinions on certain subjects and advice as well, but if you want to HELP me out, I am down for that, but if you are just going to sit there and make fun of the way i do things and say I just put things on my car and "HOPE" they make my car faster is a really jerky thing to say. I'm not out there aimlessly purchasing mods to my car and just closing my eyes and saying "OH THERE 20 HP!"...I do everytihng the best I can...I'll say it again too, a 3" downpipe and 3" cat is better than the stock cat...I wasn't doing it to make it all big sounding, i just wanted to replace the stock cat and i cant afford the "Hi-Flow Cats", so i just ran a bigger diameter cat, that's a valid move I made. Everyone is taking the 3" thing way too personal and getting offended by it, its silly, i did it just to replace the cat, just think of it as a HI-FLOW cat, see nobody would make fun of that nwo would they? Plus, a vibrant muffler if i am right, is a more flowing muffler than stock, and adds an extra outlet to release exhaust, so i picked a good move on that as well in my mind. I am not on this forum to have beefs, but i know when somebody is trying to be mean or has alterior motives when they are leaving me comments, and frankly, many of 03neonrt's comments have been downright snotty. Also I might add, some of them have actually been useful when he's not being snippy and negatively addresssing my situations. I go out on the line and reach out to you guys with problems, and I expect positive feedback with tips and advice, I dont need anybody going to the past and making remarks of what they thought was a bad idea, theres no such thing as a bad mod, it's only considered good, taking extra money out and putting towards your vehicle is always a treat. Theres just better ways to being critical, i wouldnt mind your criticism either r/t,but if you can do it without coming off impatient and jerky, ud find id actually appreciate a lot of what you say, and by the way, i agree with you on what needs to be done, just not the way you keep telling me, thats all. I'm not lookin to get into arguments, i like having you guys as my buddies for all of our "PROJECT NEONS".

 

It is NOT like a high flow cat. It is like having NO cat and NO exhaust tubing. Thats almost the same thing as sticking a downpipe and no exhaust at all. It does the same thing.

I am not knocking the REASON you installed it on the car. The REASON it is not good is because of the entirety of the situation. You have a 3" downpipe... which is bad becuase it is right AFTER the header and it goes INTO a 3" cat. THIS IS JUST AS BAD AS RUNNING A FULL 3" exhaust system. The reason this is, is because you form a lot of this back pressure around your downpipe and front cat. You gain nothing from increasing it that much.

 

I didn't seem to lose any horsepower, or gain much h/p with the 3" cat, it even sounded and acted the same as the stock cat and downpipe. So are you saying even where there is plently of backpressure to the exhaust with the 2.25" piping right after the cat and then the vibrant muffler that it's still like running a straight through 3" exhaust? I just have a hard time believing that considering it still has many obstacles to go through before it's released out of the car. To me, it's one tihng to have no piping after the header or a straight through 3" system, that i know is going to create a loss of power. But with my situation, it did not seem at all to me that i lost horsepower. I felt a slight gain in horsepower in higher rpms though, this is where most mods go on the neon anyway, the upper end. If I though it made me lose horsepower I probably wouldhave posted a thread about it like i did on the throttle body, which i decided to just stick with considering it does infact help out A LOT during hard accelleration, which is where it matters most to me anyways. Definately wasn't looking to get in stupid fights on this subject, it's just not my style, but I just feel like I can tell when somebody isn't being genuine, and it shows, and its over with. 03NEONRT, I'd like you input and advice on things in the future, I just sometimes get a really negative vibe from you and I can tell your not trying to be nice, which doesn't make sense to me? I know you can be helpful, i've seen your responses u leave me sometimes, and theres a big differance, when ur helpin out it does help out, but when you have a problem with me, i can tell your just kind of being nasty, if you can get rid of that, then id love to have your help and all that good stuff, kewl?

P.S: I am going crazy here, does anyone know how to download the program I need to make it so I can post pics from my camera phone. It's a motorola razor, I want to show you guys some pics of the neon with the new r/t bumper and custom fitted vibrant!

 

you don't need a program, i have the same phone, RAZR V3t, all you do is go to MY COMPUTER, and look for the REMOVABLE DISK, go in there and you will see some folders, just look for the one that says photos. I am typing this off the top of my head but it should be the correct procedure

 

Yea, you'd see an improvement over stock on the high end with that much free flowing room in the exhaust at the get go... but it will drag under low RPM's. You gain a little back from the 2.25 piping but definately not a lot to compensate for the huge 3" dp and cat. Plus, you really gain no back pressure from the cat's and that junk. It really just limits exhaust flow to silence and reduce emissions.

I would, if you are interested, look into a good borla or magnaflow when you get some spare moolah. Replace all that old tubing and gain everything back.

 

wow..looks like i missed alot

 

When you say borla or magnaflow, are toy referring to a muffler, or piping? If it's the muffler, Im afraid im sticking with my vibrant lol, i kind of have an incentive at this point to stick with it considering i spent all that extra cash to make it look factory with an r.t bumper haha, but i really love my vibrant so i dont think ill change that, but if you were referring to piping, you saying you think i should get rid of the 3" cat and downpipe and replace with a stock sized hi-flow cat and what not?

 

well, unless your car is turbo'd..... you shouldn't run anything BIGGER than a 2.25 in tubing. The brands I pointed out are FULL systems, meaning they are as free-flowing as can be without sacrificing back pressure.

if you really feel like you NEED a 2.5" tubing... (which I suggest against) then an SRT exhaust is something you could look into.

I think you'd see a pretty good gain with a good quality exhaust system over the (sorry to say) custom one you are running now. Ask 03 or anyone else for that matter, the simple problem with N/A cars is maintaining a balance between back pressure and free flowing exhaust. You want to maintain Backpressure but to a certain extent that it is still as free flowing as possible for the N/A engine.

here is a simple graph to help you out:



the Corky Bell curve shows when piping on N/A cars becomes a restriction in your quest for power.

Notice how the good ol, stock, 2.25" tubing is good till 200 BHP! N/A is lucky to even see 195 in the neon world.

If your planning on turboing, I would suggest waiting on the turbo before buying anything else for your exhaust system. Thats where I am. I am planning on turbo-ing here in a few years (once I get the Ca-yish) and so I threw on a Vibrant muffler. No need to go and buy a good system when I will be need 2.5-3" tubing later on.