T-Stat
#1
12-11-2007, 11:24 AM
Join Date: Mar 2005
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T-Stat
Just thumbing through the Summit web site and noticed they offer a 160 deg t-stat. Not sure if this will have any adverse effect. Has anyone gone this low? Seems to me once it gets below a certain point it no longer makes a difference. Do our trucks even sense the coolant temp as an inputto the ecu/m? Dont remember. I know heat is a factor in wear of engine parts but does anyone know what the temp would be if there was no regulator(t-stat)?
#3
12-11-2007, 11:40 AM
RE: T-Stat
^LOL^
160 is plenty fine. For your purposes all you need be concerned about is overheating vs underheating, not how it effects performance. How it effects performance is entirely neglagable unless your building a performance setup in which case you are trying to make all the parts work in conjunction with a very close tollerance, unlike a stock/near stock vehicle where lots of "slop" in combination of parts is fine. That being said, 160 for the winter is too cold if you live in any climate that gets mildly chilly, that is if you want to opperate your heat so its more than a warm breath. If you have heating problems in the summer a 160 would probabily help you out. For a regular every daily driver Id suggest going with a 185 though, it gives a nice happy medium incase you dont want to change thermos. every winter/summer, or deal with the "problems"
160 is plenty fine. For your purposes all you need be concerned about is overheating vs underheating, not how it effects performance. How it effects performance is entirely neglagable unless your building a performance setup in which case you are trying to make all the parts work in conjunction with a very close tollerance, unlike a stock/near stock vehicle where lots of "slop" in combination of parts is fine. That being said, 160 for the winter is too cold if you live in any climate that gets mildly chilly, that is if you want to opperate your heat so its more than a warm breath. If you have heating problems in the summer a 160 would probabily help you out. For a regular every daily driver Id suggest going with a 185 though, it gives a nice happy medium incase you dont want to change thermos. every winter/summer, or deal with the "problems"
#4
12-11-2007, 12:18 PM
RE: T-Stat
ORIGINAL: IndyRamMan
^LOL^
160 is plenty fine. For your purposes all you need be concerned about is overheating vs underheating, not how it effects performance. How it effects performance is entirely neglagable unless your building a performance setup in which case you are trying to make all the parts work in conjunction with a very close tollerance, unlike a stock/near stock vehicle where lots of "slop" in combination of parts is fine. That being said, 160 for the winter is too cold if you live in any climate that gets mildly chilly, that is if you want to opperate your heat so its more than a warm breath. If you have heating problems in the summer a 160 would probabily help you out. For a regular every daily driver Id suggest going with a 185 though, it gives a nice happy medium incase you dont want to change thermos. every winter/summer, or deal with the "problems"
^LOL^
160 is plenty fine. For your purposes all you need be concerned about is overheating vs underheating, not how it effects performance. How it effects performance is entirely neglagable unless your building a performance setup in which case you are trying to make all the parts work in conjunction with a very close tollerance, unlike a stock/near stock vehicle where lots of "slop" in combination of parts is fine. That being said, 160 for the winter is too cold if you live in any climate that gets mildly chilly, that is if you want to opperate your heat so its more than a warm breath. If you have heating problems in the summer a 160 would probabily help you out. For a regular every daily driver Id suggest going with a 185 though, it gives a nice happy medium incase you dont want to change thermos. every winter/summer, or deal with the "problems"
#5
12-11-2007, 12:24 PM
RE: T-Stat
ORIGINAL: VWandDodge
160ยบ is way too damned cold for a V8. Where the hell do you guys come up with this crap that the lower t-stat is so great? If that's true, then why run one at all?
ORIGINAL: IndyRamMan
^LOL^
160 is plenty fine. For your purposes all you need be concerned about is overheating vs underheating, not how it effects performance. How it effects performance is entirely neglagable unless your building a performance setup in which case you are trying to make all the parts work in conjunction with a very close tollerance, unlike a stock/near stock vehicle where lots of "slop" in combination of parts is fine. That being said, 160 for the winter is too cold if you live in any climate that gets mildly chilly, that is if you want to opperate your heat so its more than a warm breath. If you have heating problems in the summer a 160 would probabily help you out. For a regular every daily driver Id suggest going with a 185 though, it gives a nice happy medium incase you dont want to change thermos. every winter/summer, or deal with the "problems"
^LOL^
160 is plenty fine. For your purposes all you need be concerned about is overheating vs underheating, not how it effects performance. How it effects performance is entirely neglagable unless your building a performance setup in which case you are trying to make all the parts work in conjunction with a very close tollerance, unlike a stock/near stock vehicle where lots of "slop" in combination of parts is fine. That being said, 160 for the winter is too cold if you live in any climate that gets mildly chilly, that is if you want to opperate your heat so its more than a warm breath. If you have heating problems in the summer a 160 would probabily help you out. For a regular every daily driver Id suggest going with a 185 though, it gives a nice happy medium incase you dont want to change thermos. every winter/summer, or deal with the "problems"
To further drive my point home, I have some questions for you to answer that will be simple to answer if what you say (160 is too cold for v8s) is true, AND you know why that would be true.
1. Why would anyone produce a 160 thermostat for a V8 if it is too damned cold? If that is true, their product wouldnt sell, and they would have wasted quite a bit of money manufacturing a worthless product.
2. What temp do "drag" cars try to run at?
3. When is a 160* thermostat acceptable, a 4 cyl, a v6, what? Obviously you know its no good for 8 cylinders, so it must be good for something, right?
Anyways, sorry for taking this thread off course for my own personal ammusement. Your answer is in my previous post.
#6
12-11-2007, 01:11 PM
Grand Champion
RE: T-Stat
ORIGINAL: IndyRamMan
To further drive my point home, I have some questions for you to answer that will be simple to answer if what you say (160 is too cold for v8s) is true, AND you know why that would be true.
1. Why would anyone produce a 160 thermostat for a V8 if it is too damned cold? If that is true, their product wouldnt sell, and they would have wasted quite a bit of money manufacturing a worthless product.
2. What temp do "drag" cars try to run at?
3. When is a 160* thermostat acceptable, a 4 cyl, a v6, what? Obviously you know its no good for 8 cylinders, so it must be good for something, right?
To further drive my point home, I have some questions for you to answer that will be simple to answer if what you say (160 is too cold for v8s) is true, AND you know why that would be true.
1. Why would anyone produce a 160 thermostat for a V8 if it is too damned cold? If that is true, their product wouldnt sell, and they would have wasted quite a bit of money manufacturing a worthless product.
2. What temp do "drag" cars try to run at?
3. When is a 160* thermostat acceptable, a 4 cyl, a v6, what? Obviously you know its no good for 8 cylinders, so it must be good for something, right?
1) Just becasue someone makes something, doesn't mean it should be used on all applications without any questions. T-stats are fairly universal. They are not making a 160 specifically for a Dodge Magnum engine, it is made for a variety of applications.
2) Who cares, drag cars are designed to go 1/4 mile at a time, not to be run for hours on end as a daily driver. That comparison is pointless. Using that logic, it would be fine to run drag slicks year round on my 1/2 ton just because thats what drag cars run.
3) It depends not on the number of cylinders, but on the use of the vehicle.
What you are failing to realize is that you drive a PCM controlled truck that uses engine coolant temp (among other things) to determine when you are in open loop versus closed loop mod. You have to stay within the PCM's capabilities, or you will just run rich, which fouls plugs and O2 sensors. So unless you have modified your PCM to accept the use of a 160, it is not going to perform correctly with your stock PCM. Lastly, if your engine never reaches a sufficient temp, your shortening its life by causing carbon and sludge buildups and reducing cylinder wall lubrication efficiency. I definetly wouldn't run anything less then a 180.
#7
12-11-2007, 01:18 PM
RE: T-Stat
ORIGINAL: Silver_Dodge
Let me address your questions is I may:
1) Just becasue someone makes something, doesn't mean it should be used on all applications without any questions. T-stats are fairly universal. They are not making a 160 specifically for a Dodge Magnum engine, it is made for a variety of applications.
2) Who cares, drag cars are designed to go 1/4 mile at a time, not to be run for hours on end as a daily driver. That comparison is pointless. Using that logic, it would be fine to run drag slicks year round on my 1/2 ton just because thats what drag cars run.
3) It depends not on the number of cylinders, but on the use of the vehicle.
What you are failing to realize is that you drive a PCM controlled truck that uses engine coolant temp (among other things) to determine when you are in open loop versus closed loop mod. You have to stay within the PCM's capabilities, or you will just run rich, which fouls plugs and O2 sensors. So unless you have modified your PCM to accept the use of a 160, it is not going to perform correctly with your stock PCM. Lastly, if your engine never reaches a sufficient temp, your shortening its life by causing carbon and sludge buildups and reducing cylinder wall lubrication efficiency. I definetly wouldn't run anything less then a 180.
ORIGINAL: IndyRamMan
To further drive my point home, I have some questions for you to answer that will be simple to answer if what you say (160 is too cold for v8s) is true, AND you know why that would be true.
1. Why would anyone produce a 160 thermostat for a V8 if it is too damned cold? If that is true, their product wouldnt sell, and they would have wasted quite a bit of money manufacturing a worthless product.
2. What temp do "drag" cars try to run at?
3. When is a 160* thermostat acceptable, a 4 cyl, a v6, what? Obviously you know its no good for 8 cylinders, so it must be good for something, right?
To further drive my point home, I have some questions for you to answer that will be simple to answer if what you say (160 is too cold for v8s) is true, AND you know why that would be true.
1. Why would anyone produce a 160 thermostat for a V8 if it is too damned cold? If that is true, their product wouldnt sell, and they would have wasted quite a bit of money manufacturing a worthless product.
2. What temp do "drag" cars try to run at?
3. When is a 160* thermostat acceptable, a 4 cyl, a v6, what? Obviously you know its no good for 8 cylinders, so it must be good for something, right?
1) Just becasue someone makes something, doesn't mean it should be used on all applications without any questions. T-stats are fairly universal. They are not making a 160 specifically for a Dodge Magnum engine, it is made for a variety of applications.
2) Who cares, drag cars are designed to go 1/4 mile at a time, not to be run for hours on end as a daily driver. That comparison is pointless. Using that logic, it would be fine to run drag slicks year round on my 1/2 ton just because thats what drag cars run.
3) It depends not on the number of cylinders, but on the use of the vehicle.
What you are failing to realize is that you drive a PCM controlled truck that uses engine coolant temp (among other things) to determine when you are in open loop versus closed loop mod. You have to stay within the PCM's capabilities, or you will just run rich, which fouls plugs and O2 sensors. So unless you have modified your PCM to accept the use of a 160, it is not going to perform correctly with your stock PCM. Lastly, if your engine never reaches a sufficient temp, your shortening its life by causing carbon and sludge buildups and reducing cylinder wall lubrication efficiency. I definetly wouldn't run anything less then a 180.
2) What if someone was building a drag car? Wouldn't the point be valid then?
3) I completely agree.
With that said, I am done.
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#8
12-11-2007, 01:27 PM
Record Breaker
RE: T-Stat
hate to break it to you guys but no drag car is gonna use a tstat ... Now i do things not cause what some one in a forum said , i do it cause it makes sense , my truck running a stock 195 tstat ran at 205/210 , now my truck runs just below the 200 mark(180tstat) , you can go on line and check your local parts place and they will have some with a 160 (depends on years) this they call extreme tstat and say from towing or under heavy loads... now i think the truck runs closed loop at temp 130 but even at 160 you run a risk throwing a CEL
#9
12-11-2007, 01:34 PM
RE: T-Stat
ORIGINAL: Silver_Dodge
Let me address your questions is I may:
1) Just becasue someone makes something, doesn't mean it should be used on all applications without any questions. T-stats are fairly universal. They are not making a 160 specifically for a Dodge Magnum engine, it is made for a variety of applications.
2) Who cares, drag cars are designed to go 1/4 mile at a time, not to be run for hours on end as a daily driver. That comparison is pointless. Using that logic, it would be fine to run drag slicks year round on my 1/2 ton just because thats what drag cars run.
3) It depends not on the number of cylinders, but on the use of the vehicle.
What you are failing to realize is that you drive a PCM controlled truck that uses engine coolant temp (among other things) to determine when you are in open loop versus closed loop mod. You have to stay within the PCM's capabilities, or you will just run rich, which fouls plugs and O2 sensors. So unless you have modified your PCM to accept the use of a 160, it is not going to perform correctly with your stock PCM. Lastly, if your engine never reaches a sufficient temp, your shortening its life by causing carbon and sludge buildups and reducing cylinder wall lubrication efficiency. I definetly wouldn't run anything less then a 180.
You make my point even further, even though you were trying to counter it. He was speeking genericly, as was I. Just because its a V8 doesnt mean V8s IN GENERAL use or do not use certian parts for diffrent reasons. As I said earlier we arent talking about a performance vehicle, so that doesnt apply. I was just saying, "drag" cars are v8s (for the most part) and they dont run 210*s, so the idea that 160 is bad for v8s is wrong. Thats all im pointing out. Like i said, I think a 185 would be a happy meduim. There is going to be no performance gains whatsoever, and as you say it will be more than likely detremental(even though I did not include the part about warming up, because Im assuming were talking about at opperating temp). So thank you for backing up my point.
ORIGINAL: IndyRamMan
To further drive my point home, I have some questions for you to answer that will be simple to answer if what you say (160 is too cold for v8s) is true, AND you know why that would be true.
1. Why would anyone produce a 160 thermostat for a V8 if it is too damned cold? If that is true, their product wouldnt sell, and they would have wasted quite a bit of money manufacturing a worthless product.
2. What temp do "drag" cars try to run at?
3. When is a 160* thermostat acceptable, a 4 cyl, a v6, what? Obviously you know its no good for 8 cylinders, so it must be good for something, right?
To further drive my point home, I have some questions for you to answer that will be simple to answer if what you say (160 is too cold for v8s) is true, AND you know why that would be true.
1. Why would anyone produce a 160 thermostat for a V8 if it is too damned cold? If that is true, their product wouldnt sell, and they would have wasted quite a bit of money manufacturing a worthless product.
2. What temp do "drag" cars try to run at?
3. When is a 160* thermostat acceptable, a 4 cyl, a v6, what? Obviously you know its no good for 8 cylinders, so it must be good for something, right?
1) Just becasue someone makes something, doesn't mean it should be used on all applications without any questions. T-stats are fairly universal. They are not making a 160 specifically for a Dodge Magnum engine, it is made for a variety of applications.
2) Who cares, drag cars are designed to go 1/4 mile at a time, not to be run for hours on end as a daily driver. That comparison is pointless. Using that logic, it would be fine to run drag slicks year round on my 1/2 ton just because thats what drag cars run.
3) It depends not on the number of cylinders, but on the use of the vehicle.
What you are failing to realize is that you drive a PCM controlled truck that uses engine coolant temp (among other things) to determine when you are in open loop versus closed loop mod. You have to stay within the PCM's capabilities, or you will just run rich, which fouls plugs and O2 sensors. So unless you have modified your PCM to accept the use of a 160, it is not going to perform correctly with your stock PCM. Lastly, if your engine never reaches a sufficient temp, your shortening its life by causing carbon and sludge buildups and reducing cylinder wall lubrication efficiency. I definetly wouldn't run anything less then a 180.
You make my point even further, even though you were trying to counter it. He was speeking genericly, as was I. Just because its a V8 doesnt mean V8s IN GENERAL use or do not use certian parts for diffrent reasons. As I said earlier we arent talking about a performance vehicle, so that doesnt apply. I was just saying, "drag" cars are v8s (for the most part) and they dont run 210*s, so the idea that 160 is bad for v8s is wrong. Thats all im pointing out. Like i said, I think a 185 would be a happy meduim. There is going to be no performance gains whatsoever, and as you say it will be more than likely detremental(even though I did not include the part about warming up, because Im assuming were talking about at opperating temp). So thank you for backing up my point.
#10
12-11-2007, 01:53 PM
Legend