Performance mods: Do they really work?
all the little mods add up, i like all the little bolt ons i did, noticed it in someway either power or noise, thats the things with truck there our toys. its fun being better than chevy and fords 
Veteran
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 310
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From: Alma, AR
Heres something to think about.
Drive a stock truck and see how many miles it goes till the motor goes bad or something major goes wrong.... (Say it goes 150k)
Lets take a identical truck and add all the bolt ons you claim arnt worth their 2 cents. This same truck will go 200k. Now you tell me.. Was it worth it? Not only could you push the pedal and feel a little speed with your mods you gained some mpgs while doing it.
Seems silly really that you don't consider bolt ons worth the money...
You sound almost jealous... Did someone beat you in a race with bolt ons or something and your out to get them?
Drive a stock truck and see how many miles it goes till the motor goes bad or something major goes wrong.... (Say it goes 150k)
Lets take a identical truck and add all the bolt ons you claim arnt worth their 2 cents. This same truck will go 200k. Now you tell me.. Was it worth it? Not only could you push the pedal and feel a little speed with your mods you gained some mpgs while doing it.
Seems silly really that you don't consider bolt ons worth the money...
You sound almost jealous... Did someone beat you in a race with bolt ons or something and your out to get them?
Professional
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 247
Likes: 0
From: Adams Center, NY/ Bagram, Afghani Land
I'm going to get a grip of flak for this, but here goes.
There is no point in modifying these trucks in search of power gains. Here's why.
Unless you go the procharger route(which is still a pretty weak gain), you are throwing your money away.
Sure you can get awesome air cleaners (lose torque) and shiny headers (lose torque) zomgalientech spark plugs (power gain in the head), awesomely wide throttle body's (no real gain) bla bla bla, at the end of the day these trucks are still land yachts.
The best thing you can do is save your money for maintaining what you already have, and enjoy it. These trucks put about 170hp to the wheels. They aren't race cars, nor will they ever be. The transmissions are really just Pinata's filed with ATF-4, our Differentials are filled with water with gears made of JB Weld, water color paint on the bodies, ball joints and wheel bearing made from spaghetti, and dipstick tubes made from pixie sticks.
They are fun trucks, but there really is no power to "unleash" without spending an extreme amount of money,(and usually totally replacing the engine), more money than the truck itself is probably worth.
So enjoy them. Put sweet tires on them, add lights, Radio's and other equipment. Just don't waste your money on performance mods, because in the end the only thing power you've gained is in your head. The only mod that will give you any real gain is the "different vehicle" mod.
/soapbox
There is no point in modifying these trucks in search of power gains. Here's why.
Unless you go the procharger route(which is still a pretty weak gain), you are throwing your money away.
Sure you can get awesome air cleaners (lose torque) and shiny headers (lose torque) zomgalientech spark plugs (power gain in the head), awesomely wide throttle body's (no real gain) bla bla bla, at the end of the day these trucks are still land yachts.
The best thing you can do is save your money for maintaining what you already have, and enjoy it. These trucks put about 170hp to the wheels. They aren't race cars, nor will they ever be. The transmissions are really just Pinata's filed with ATF-4, our Differentials are filled with water with gears made of JB Weld, water color paint on the bodies, ball joints and wheel bearing made from spaghetti, and dipstick tubes made from pixie sticks.
They are fun trucks, but there really is no power to "unleash" without spending an extreme amount of money,(and usually totally replacing the engine), more money than the truck itself is probably worth.
So enjoy them. Put sweet tires on them, add lights, Radio's and other equipment. Just don't waste your money on performance mods, because in the end the only thing power you've gained is in your head. The only mod that will give you any real gain is the "different vehicle" mod.
/soapbox
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Professional
Joined: Jul 2007
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Are you kidding me?
Lets see if I can make this simple for you.
#1. I dont race trucks. Dont care to. Trucks arent for racing, they are for hauling and working and towing and off roading.
#2. If someone with lots of mods were to race my truck, and win, it would back up the claim that mods have signifigant worth. So why would I jeolously attack the premise of modding a truck if my motivation were as you guessed?
#3. I havent claimed that mods are worthless. I was originally making an observation that some people put too much value into bolt on mods, and some tend to overstate their value especially after they have spent a lot of money on them. Throttle body spacers are a perfect example. It is well known on here they are worthless for our trucks. Yet out in the real world you will find people who swear they made their 10 year old 318 run so much quicker and get 2 more MPG. Why do people think so? Is it conscious embellishment or subconscious? Serious question...
#4. Why are you so upset with my questions? Why is it that you think I have personally insulted you?
#5 You say a truck with mods will outlast a stock motor....DUH! You replace parts and take care of it (like most people who are doing mods will) and of course it will last longer.
#6. I think there are very likely many mods that do work, and that add a real value to our trucks. Part of the intention of this thread is trying to flesh out which mods are they. New caps and rotors? Air raids? Gears? M1? Where should people on this board spend their hard earned money in this time of recession? What is cost effective? And who would need which mod?
And the final point:
#7. Perhaps you want some of my motivation, OK, I'll say it like this.
I am a hardcore believer in the idea that there is no such thing as a free lunch. Ever heard that saying?
These bolt on mods sound almost like a free lunch. They are being made out to sound like that. Too good to be true. And I do hate that some people will waste good money cause of marketing hype. People have been working on internal combustion engines for over 100 years. There is no magic touch that will instantly add 50 HP, what tricks there were to be found have been incorporated into engines as a part of their design over the past many years. Most of the mods people are doing are not because engineers suddenly became smarter in the years since our trucks were made. Instead, these mods represent nothing more than altering the tradeoffs made by Dodge in their decision making. Sometimes the tradeoff is the price of the component. These are cases where perhaps a stock component was mass produced cheaply, and while it got the job done, with a little bit better materiels you could get a little better performance. Maybe like upgrading plug wires - not much of a difference, but you are trading money for marginally better performance. There are other instances where user-friendliness might have been part of the tradeoff. The stock intake setup is quiet, something that was good for selling the trucks off the lot. The round filters have a whoosh that might scare some people from buying a new truck. Perhaps you can pick up a little performance there. But its not a hell of a lot. And I think people should be made aware of the limitations of bolt ons. For the most part I think Dodge made the right decisions regarding the components used on our trucks in making a truck that appealed and was usefull to the most people possible.
Most of my critique has been centered on doubting the importance of little mods like the bolt ons I mentioned above for most people. Now maybe if you are, for whatever reason, into racing your truck, every little bit - even if it means cutting weight by removing the spares, rear bumper, whatever, and two grand in bolt on mods - every little bit is critical. For you, you might fall in the %5 percent of guys who have a real need for the modification. But for the man towing his boat to the lake or his kids to football practice, they more likely should save all the money that they are throwing at the mass marketed holy grail that doesnt exist of bolt on automotive performance and instead buy more gas and safe tires and keep the fluids changed.
Lets see if I can make this simple for you.
#1. I dont race trucks. Dont care to. Trucks arent for racing, they are for hauling and working and towing and off roading.
#2. If someone with lots of mods were to race my truck, and win, it would back up the claim that mods have signifigant worth. So why would I jeolously attack the premise of modding a truck if my motivation were as you guessed?
#3. I havent claimed that mods are worthless. I was originally making an observation that some people put too much value into bolt on mods, and some tend to overstate their value especially after they have spent a lot of money on them. Throttle body spacers are a perfect example. It is well known on here they are worthless for our trucks. Yet out in the real world you will find people who swear they made their 10 year old 318 run so much quicker and get 2 more MPG. Why do people think so? Is it conscious embellishment or subconscious? Serious question...
#4. Why are you so upset with my questions? Why is it that you think I have personally insulted you?
#5 You say a truck with mods will outlast a stock motor....DUH! You replace parts and take care of it (like most people who are doing mods will) and of course it will last longer.
#6. I think there are very likely many mods that do work, and that add a real value to our trucks. Part of the intention of this thread is trying to flesh out which mods are they. New caps and rotors? Air raids? Gears? M1? Where should people on this board spend their hard earned money in this time of recession? What is cost effective? And who would need which mod?
And the final point:
#7. Perhaps you want some of my motivation, OK, I'll say it like this.
I am a hardcore believer in the idea that there is no such thing as a free lunch. Ever heard that saying?
These bolt on mods sound almost like a free lunch. They are being made out to sound like that. Too good to be true. And I do hate that some people will waste good money cause of marketing hype. People have been working on internal combustion engines for over 100 years. There is no magic touch that will instantly add 50 HP, what tricks there were to be found have been incorporated into engines as a part of their design over the past many years. Most of the mods people are doing are not because engineers suddenly became smarter in the years since our trucks were made. Instead, these mods represent nothing more than altering the tradeoffs made by Dodge in their decision making. Sometimes the tradeoff is the price of the component. These are cases where perhaps a stock component was mass produced cheaply, and while it got the job done, with a little bit better materiels you could get a little better performance. Maybe like upgrading plug wires - not much of a difference, but you are trading money for marginally better performance. There are other instances where user-friendliness might have been part of the tradeoff. The stock intake setup is quiet, something that was good for selling the trucks off the lot. The round filters have a whoosh that might scare some people from buying a new truck. Perhaps you can pick up a little performance there. But its not a hell of a lot. And I think people should be made aware of the limitations of bolt ons. For the most part I think Dodge made the right decisions regarding the components used on our trucks in making a truck that appealed and was usefull to the most people possible.
Most of my critique has been centered on doubting the importance of little mods like the bolt ons I mentioned above for most people. Now maybe if you are, for whatever reason, into racing your truck, every little bit - even if it means cutting weight by removing the spares, rear bumper, whatever, and two grand in bolt on mods - every little bit is critical. For you, you might fall in the %5 percent of guys who have a real need for the modification. But for the man towing his boat to the lake or his kids to football practice, they more likely should save all the money that they are throwing at the mass marketed holy grail that doesnt exist of bolt on automotive performance and instead buy more gas and safe tires and keep the fluids changed.
Last edited by WTL; Dec 27, 2008 at 09:48 PM.
Veteran
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 310
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From: Alma, AR
Ok, this is BS! Lets start with the tranny thing. Yes I got it that these trucks dont have a bullet proof tranny. Well, if you want a piece of crap 700R4 go get it. In my opinion, you keep up with the maint on these tranny's for instance not just changing the fluid but making sure the bands are adjusted these tranny's last just as long as just about any other tranny made during this time period. You gripe about the gears but if you want manual hubs go get a Ford and if you want IFS go buy a chevy! Not once did you even think that the off road package of these trucks is basically a 3/4 ton suspension and the frame is strong enough to take the abuse of pulling a goose neck trailer every single week. Oh yeah, and the power thing, this months issue of Engine Masters, Dodge 318 Magnum with 425hp and 386lb/ft of torque. Mods list: heads, intake and cam. Hot Rod Mag, Dogde 360 Magnum with 448hp and 434lb/ft of torque. Mods list: heads, intake, and cam. Now these arent the only things done to these engines but the big things! Both builds were called junkyard builds!!! Oh and got to mopartsracing.com, 395hp multi port fuel injection kits for the 360. A cold air intake might sound dumb and insignificant to you but hell some of us gotta start somewhere. If you dont like your truck, keep your mouth shut. You aint gotta argue and **** the rest of us off with your ignorance.
Veteran
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 310
Likes: 0
From: Alma, AR
Dude who ever said you can't race trucks? Are you serious? A truck is a toy. A toy is something you play with to give you fun. If your fun is racing than DUH a truck can be a racer... For some reason its scolded in your head that our truck can't be made fast? Your wrong.
If you add a super charger sure you get quite a bit of power. But don't you think you need a better flowing exhaust to release the power? Or a 360 design air intake so you can pull in more air? Bolt ons are what make some major mod you do to your truck. They are all worth it. All benefit in some form or fashion..
Quit being a downer which is exactly what your doing. I think you were reading the thread where poeple were dissapointed with their module that didnt give them the 200 HP it promised...
If you add a super charger sure you get quite a bit of power. But don't you think you need a better flowing exhaust to release the power? Or a 360 design air intake so you can pull in more air? Bolt ons are what make some major mod you do to your truck. They are all worth it. All benefit in some form or fashion..
Quit being a downer which is exactly what your doing. I think you were reading the thread where poeple were dissapointed with their module that didnt give them the 200 HP it promised...
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Professional
Joined: Jul 2007
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People can and do work on old VW beetles. Why? I dont know, perhaps its what they had, perhaps they like the challenge of racing one.
You are the guys who are heavily specialized, and maybe the same ones who have taken too much exception to what I have said. If you want to do it with your truck, hell, man go for it.
Most people dont use trucks like that though. Most use them for what they were designed to do. Reread my last post. If you want to race, its clear you are going to have to do many mods some minor and some major.
But again, there is no such thing as free horsepower that you magically unlock. It costs money, effort, durability, sight, sound or smell to make the modifications. We are dealing with tradeoffs here.
You are the guys who are heavily specialized, and maybe the same ones who have taken too much exception to what I have said. If you want to do it with your truck, hell, man go for it.
Most people dont use trucks like that though. Most use them for what they were designed to do. Reread my last post. If you want to race, its clear you are going to have to do many mods some minor and some major.
But again, there is no such thing as free horsepower that you magically unlock. It costs money, effort, durability, sight, sound or smell to make the modifications. We are dealing with tradeoffs here.
Record Breaker
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,488
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From: Oregon
A truck is whatever you want your truck to be, its not there for somebody to tell you it cant be raced, its not there for somebody to say nothing makes it better, if one guy wants to leave his stock to save money for gas, thats his prerogative, if the other guy thinks he will save more in gas by putting the CAI on, then let him do it, if anything, it keeps our economy going, if everyone stopped buying things that they wanted, our economy would become useless, people would only be able to get what is needed, and thats all. Now dont tell everyone here that you think that none of this stuff does anything, because it does something for them, I personally like putting these apparently "useless" mods on my truck, I dont find them useless, I know you dont feel the change in the instant of putting one tiny mod on your truck, but take all the mods off, run your truck with the pedal to the floor, then put all of them on at the same time, Ill bet you feel the difference then, and Im sure everyone agrees on here that a tb spacer isnt worth it, thats been brought up many times, thats why everyone who has actually read into these forums knows that the spacer isnt the big change, its the larger bore throttle body, say a holley, or a fastman, 50 mm for a 5.2 and a 52 mm for a 5.9. But until you have tried what I have said, dont act like you know what its going to do, I really want someone who argues that their mods dont do anything, someone who has a bunch and doesnt have faith in them to take them all of and test it, then put them all back on. Test different things as well, drive until your tank is empty and test gas mileage, just try them all before arguing about something that everyone here is going to get all uptight about when noone needs to, the truck is there to be enjoyed, if you dont enjoy it, then dont talk about it.
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Joined: Dec 2005
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Im gonna agree with WTL on this one, race your truck if you want, if that's what you want to do, go ahead. he is not criticizing you for wanting to race your truck against other people, for all means do it if thats your thing. just do it at the track and not on every city street. im just sick of hearing these people on here talk about how there truck is the best, this forum was made for getting insite, not for bragging rights. just take a step back and think before you say something stupid. that's all