atf 4
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Joined: Jul 2006
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From: Gainesville, Ga.
the early models used the 46RH transmission. the later models used the RE which is full of wires and solenoids.
the later models specified only ATF+3, and then later +4, probably to try and get the ****ty transmissions to last.
the later models specified only ATF+3, and then later +4, probably to try and get the ****ty transmissions to last.
it just says mopar ATF plus (type 7176) preferred on the back...in the manual it says you should use aft to avoid the shudder that can be caused by dexron 3 doesnt say anything about dexron 2. But here's the catch it says dexron 2 or atf on the dipstick...many shops only carry dexron or mercon? again wouldnt their be a mass of failed dodge trannies after anyone get any fluild changes? It also says that chrysler recommends you take it to a chrysler dealership for any and all transmission maintenance..(not practical). and why would it state to use dexron3 at all if it could actually damage your tranny? I'm sorry but thats plain stupid to state.
Either it damages the tranny or it doesnt and if it does tell us not to use it period!
My yamaha says to use only recommended yamahalube in it too.....I wonder what makes it work different than regular motoroil?
Many car makers try to plug their own branded products so usually I take it with a grain of salt especially when they list the other product to be used on the dipstick! but again thats why I asked because I never even noticed the line saying to use (and damage transmission?) when no other fluid is available which is silly because a smart person would have a quart right next to the extra quart of oil in the truck?
Either it damages the tranny or it doesnt and if it does tell us not to use it period!
My yamaha says to use only recommended yamahalube in it too.....I wonder what makes it work different than regular motoroil?
Many car makers try to plug their own branded products so usually I take it with a grain of salt especially when they list the other product to be used on the dipstick! but again thats why I asked because I never even noticed the line saying to use (and damage transmission?) when no other fluid is available which is silly because a smart person would have a quart right next to the extra quart of oil in the truck?
In 1996, ATF +4 DID NOT Exist. At the time, there was only ATF 2 and ATF3. Chrysler deemed both aceptable to use. In my manual, and if need be, I will scan it in, it states to use nothing except ATF +2 or ATF +3. Being that you can't get any of those any more, Chrysler reccomends using ATF +4.
There is a reason why people tell you to stay away from dexron. It has higher amounts of cleaning agents in it that are determental to a tranny that is not composed of materials capable of handling the extra additives.
Since I know you like to read, here is a site you need to look at.
http://www.allpar.com/fix/trans.html
I'll snip a little bit out of it just to seal my point.
When you change your transmission fluid, always use the recommended fluid. (1989-91 owners, ignore the manual and use ATF+4®).
Don't assume your mechanic or dealer knows what fluid to use. Ask them what they will use and make sure it's the right one. (Some people recommend watching the mechanic pour it in, and for good reason! We have been told about mechanics who said they were using ATF+4 when they were not. Is a customer's transmission worth the $10 for better fluid?)
All Chrysler four-speed and six-speed automatic transmissions* are very sensitive to the quality of the transmission fluid. Only use the ATF+4 in these transmissions. Do not use Dexron or Mercon.
Several companies now sell "universal" fluids. If they state that they are compatible with ATF+4®, they may work well, especially for those unsure of which fluid to use. The Center for Quality Assurance warned us to check the label for Chrysler’s license number, and to make sure the fluid is on their list of ATF+4® licensed and tested fluids.
Often, people can cure their transmission problems by changing the fluid and retraining the computer (see later in this page for retraining instructions)! If you suspect they have put Dexron in [note Jeep exclusion], invest the $40 or so to have it replaced immediately! [if you have a 1993-95 transmission, also follow TSB-18-24-95 and get your computer updated!
Master tech Chris Taurman wrote: “changing the fluid alone in 1993-95 units is a short term fix; the TCM must also be flashed or replaced to prevent the fluid from becoming degraded again and to eliminate partial "EMCC" torque converter clutch operation, which was the cause of 90% of torque converter shudder complaints as well as the aforementioned bump down (shift scheduling changes in the software took care of most low mileage complaints).]”
Chrysler four-speed automatics only use ATF+4, regardless of what the dipstick or owner's manual says. To quote Mopar Magazine, “ATF+4 is the right fluid for Chrysler automatic transmissions built since 2001.”
Do not use Dexron with an additive. Richard Widman passed us an extensive report from Chevron, which compared ATF+3 fluid with Dexron plus various additives. They found that neither of two major brands matched ATF+3's performance specs. ATF+4 has higher specifications.
If you don't have any problems until you have your car serviced...what does that tell you?
Frequently, a transmission that the dealer or transmission shop says is "not repairable" can be fixed with the simple steps outlined on this page, so don't give up hope just because a mechanic or two says your transmission needs to be replaced.
Testimonials and other readers' experiences
John C. Lai wrote (around 2001) that LubeGuard, used with Dexron by AAMCO, is not a good substitute for ATF+3: "...although Lubeguard claims on their website that their product will convert Dexron to become an ATF +3 (7176E) equivalent, they have no test data to back that up. Their head engineer told me that the tests they did were conducted in the early 1990s with the first version of 7176, several years before ATF+3 was developed. So, they have no basis for their claims of ATF +3 equivalency.”
Now, I wonder why things that are in bold and a good deal larger than the rest of the text are that way??????
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 8,374
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From: Sioux Falls, SD
As long as its on that list I posted a link to, you're fine.it just says mopar ATF plus (type 7176) preferred on the back...in the manual it says you should use aft to avoid the shudder that can be caused by dexron 3 doesnt say anything about dexron 2. But here's the catch it says dexron 2 or atf on the dipstick...many shops only carry dexron or mercon? again wouldnt their be a mass of failed dodge trannies after anyone get any fluild changes?
It also says that chrysler recommends you take it to a chrysler dealership for any and all transmission maintenance..(not practical). and why would it state to use dexron3 at all if it could actually damage your tranny? I'm sorry but thats plain stupid to state.
Either it damages the tranny or it doesnt and if it does tell us not to use it period!
Either it damages the tranny or it doesnt and if it does tell us not to use it period!
Very true that a lot of companies say "only use my fluid" just to get you to spend money on their stuff, so they get the profits. However, with Dodge transmissions (as Laramie obviously proved), this is not the case.
Last edited by jasonw; Oct 6, 2009 at 12:57 AM.
Personally, you might as well stick on the path you are now, since MOPAR brand anything consistently changes manufacturers. Dig it, they are a business, and what is the primary thing any good bidness worries about? Answer- Profit. The all mighty dollar.... ETC...
They switch suppliers almost every batch depending on where they can get the raw material cheapest.
Take their Oil filter for an example.
One month, you might buy an oil filter from them, and it be of a Wix design. The next time you get a MOPAR filter, it could be a Fram design.
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Joined: Jan 2013
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Regarding ATF +4. I wrote the Centre for Quality Assurance who licenses manufactures who make ATF +4. I asked if all AFT +4 is synthetic since some makes say it is, or state its a synthetic blend and some say nothing.....here is their response.
Bottom line is if its AFT+4 is ATF +4. If you have a Chrysler vehicle do not use any ATF unless it says its ATF +4. They admit synthetic is a "marketing term". too funny
Your question regarding the use of “synthetic” in ATF+4® has a very interesting answer that is not a definitive “yes” or “no”. First it is important to understand how the term “synthetic” may be used. Advanced technologies in lubricant refining, such as hydrocracking, have made it possible to refine mineral oils to such a point that the mineral oils are technically regarded as synthetic oils and may legally be marketed as such. Therefore, lubricant marketers may use the term “synthetic”, “partially synthetic”, “synthetic blend”, “fully synthetic”, or some other terminology, when the base lubricant is derived from 100% synthetic materials, 100% highly refined mineral oil, or any combination thereof. So “synthetic” is really more of a marketing term than a statement of whether the base oil comes from man-made materials or mineral oil.
In regard to ATF+4®, these same refining technologies are employed and various marketing terms are used in regard to their base oil make-up. The important factor is not so much how companies choose to use the term “synthetic” to market their lubricants, rather it is that ATF+4® has been formulated to meet the exact requirements of Chrysler transmissions. Only highly refined or man-made base oils that meet specific performance standards along with proprietary additives are qualified for use. All licensees’ products are carefully monitored and tested to ensure they meet the required specifications. With ongoing technological advances in vehicle engineering and the myriad of lubricant choices available, it is ever more important that licensing programs, such as ATF+4®, are in place to monitor product that reaches the marketplace so you, the consumer, may feel confident you are purchasing the appropriate product for your vehicle.
I hope this has helped you gain a better understanding of the term “synthetic” and Chrysler’s commitment to stay on the forefront of product engineering and quality.
Best to you for the holidays and new year,
Chiara
Center For Quality Assurance
4800 James Savage Road
Midland, Michigan 48642 USA
This document may contain legally privileged or confidential information and is intended only for the use of the parties to whom it is addressed. If you are not an intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of any information in this document is strictly prohibited. If you have received this document in error, please notify the sender and delete it immediately.Call
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Bottom line is if its AFT+4 is ATF +4. If you have a Chrysler vehicle do not use any ATF unless it says its ATF +4. They admit synthetic is a "marketing term". too funny
Your question regarding the use of “synthetic” in ATF+4® has a very interesting answer that is not a definitive “yes” or “no”. First it is important to understand how the term “synthetic” may be used. Advanced technologies in lubricant refining, such as hydrocracking, have made it possible to refine mineral oils to such a point that the mineral oils are technically regarded as synthetic oils and may legally be marketed as such. Therefore, lubricant marketers may use the term “synthetic”, “partially synthetic”, “synthetic blend”, “fully synthetic”, or some other terminology, when the base lubricant is derived from 100% synthetic materials, 100% highly refined mineral oil, or any combination thereof. So “synthetic” is really more of a marketing term than a statement of whether the base oil comes from man-made materials or mineral oil.
In regard to ATF+4®, these same refining technologies are employed and various marketing terms are used in regard to their base oil make-up. The important factor is not so much how companies choose to use the term “synthetic” to market their lubricants, rather it is that ATF+4® has been formulated to meet the exact requirements of Chrysler transmissions. Only highly refined or man-made base oils that meet specific performance standards along with proprietary additives are qualified for use. All licensees’ products are carefully monitored and tested to ensure they meet the required specifications. With ongoing technological advances in vehicle engineering and the myriad of lubricant choices available, it is ever more important that licensing programs, such as ATF+4®, are in place to monitor product that reaches the marketplace so you, the consumer, may feel confident you are purchasing the appropriate product for your vehicle.
I hope this has helped you gain a better understanding of the term “synthetic” and Chrysler’s commitment to stay on the forefront of product engineering and quality.
Best to you for the holidays and new year,
Chiara
Center For Quality Assurance
4800 James Savage Road
Midland, Michigan 48642 USA
This document may contain legally privileged or confidential information and is intended only for the use of the parties to whom it is addressed. If you are not an intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of any information in this document is strictly prohibited. If you have received this document in error, please notify the sender and delete it immediately.Call
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