3rd Gen Ram Tech 2002-2008 Rams: This section is for TECHNICAL discussions only, that involve the 2002 through 2008 Rams Rams. For any non-tech discussions, please direct your attention to the "General discussion/NON-tech" sub sections.

Possible rich condition? Can someone help me read these O2 readings?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
  #1  
Old 07-07-2020, 10:09 PM
Prismatic's Avatar
Prismatic
Prismatic is offline
All Star
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 823
Received 44 Likes on 37 Posts
Default Possible rich condition? Can someone help me read these O2 readings?

Truck seems like sometimes it has good power, and other times it feels like i'm driving a Geo Metro.

In a prior thread I asked about my cat, in this thread I've hooked up my scan tool and graphed my O2 sensors as I drive. In the video below I'm on the highway, at about 65 with a steady throttle until the end when I take the exit.
It looks to me like the entire time I'm cruising it's running rich? I'm a novice when it comes to O2 and Air fuel readings so maybe someone here with more experience can tell me if this graph looks... normal?


And this is sitting in park at about 1500rpm



Edit - I should add it's got factory intake, new air filter, no TB spacers or anything. Copper plugs put in about 15k miles ago
 

Last edited by Prismatic; 07-08-2020 at 01:25 AM.
  #2  
Old 07-08-2020, 08:12 AM
HeyYou's Avatar
HeyYou
HeyYou is offline
Administrator
Dodge Forum Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Clayton MI
Posts: 81,561
Likes: 0
Received 3,276 Likes on 3,023 Posts
Default

Well, the O2 sensor sure thinks it's running rich....... Why the PCM isn't compensating is a mystery to me. Would be interesting to see what short/long term fuel trims look like while cruising.
 
  #3  
Old 07-08-2020, 01:17 PM
Prismatic's Avatar
Prismatic
Prismatic is offline
All Star
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 823
Received 44 Likes on 37 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by HeyYou
Well, the O2 sensor sure thinks it's running rich....... Why the PCM isn't compensating is a mystery to me. Would be interesting to see what short/long term fuel trims look like while cruising.
Ill get that info for you a little later today
 
  #4  
Old 07-08-2020, 07:55 PM
Prismatic's Avatar
Prismatic
Prismatic is offline
All Star
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 823
Received 44 Likes on 37 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by HeyYou
Well, the O2 sensor sure thinks it's running rich....... Why the PCM isn't compensating is a mystery to me. Would be interesting to see what short/long term fuel trims look like while cruising.
And here's those fuel trims
Down at idle at a red light

And this is following that same highway route I did before

..And for ishts and giggles, here's the B1 S1 volts vs B1 S1 Short Term Fuel Trim on the same highway route (video starts up when I enter the highway)

I also ran a back pressure test using the upstream O2 port and I saw no meaningful pressure. 0 PSI through 3000 RPM with slight fluttering as I let off the gas, maybe 0.25psi worth.

Here's the upstream O2 sensor
https://i.imgur.com/HiYAj3l.jpg

I don't have full history on the truck but I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that's the factory O2 sensor. Maybe I'll drop a couple new ones in and see how she goes.
 

Last edited by Prismatic; 07-08-2020 at 08:01 PM.
  #5  
Old 07-08-2020, 09:27 PM
fj5gtx's Avatar
fj5gtx
fj5gtx is offline
Record Breaker
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: PA
Posts: 1,808
Received 102 Likes on 95 Posts
Default

Has the computer been tuned?
 
  #6  
Old 07-08-2020, 09:31 PM
Prismatic's Avatar
Prismatic
Prismatic is offline
All Star
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 823
Received 44 Likes on 37 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by fj5gtx
Has the computer been tuned?
Hmm unsure, it's an 03 so options are limited for it. If it's tuned it came that way from the seller.
 
  #7  
Old 07-08-2020, 09:56 PM
fj5gtx's Avatar
fj5gtx
fj5gtx is offline
Record Breaker
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: PA
Posts: 1,808
Received 102 Likes on 95 Posts
Default

I usually also look at vac and map to see more of the picture. And I pick two steady states, like idle and 2000 rpm. Snap shot more or less data, the data logging is usually for things that don't present in the steady state. I'll typically be more concerned about LTFT.
 
  #8  
Old 07-08-2020, 11:31 PM
Prismatic's Avatar
Prismatic
Prismatic is offline
All Star
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 823
Received 44 Likes on 37 Posts
Default

I don't have a vacuum gauge on me but here's map and LTFT at idle and 2000 rpm

idle



2000 rpm


Craking event (fuel pump disabled)


And starting event







How can I be drawing more vacuum at 2000rpm? I thought as throttle increased vacuum should decrease?
 

Last edited by Prismatic; 07-09-2020 at 12:02 AM.
  #9  
Old 07-09-2020, 08:31 AM
HeyYou's Avatar
HeyYou
HeyYou is offline
Administrator
Dodge Forum Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Clayton MI
Posts: 81,561
Likes: 0
Received 3,276 Likes on 3,023 Posts
Default

MAP is measuring manifold vacuum. Higher the number, the lower the pressure in the manifold.
 
  #10  
Old 07-09-2020, 05:12 PM
Prismatic's Avatar
Prismatic
Prismatic is offline
All Star
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 823
Received 44 Likes on 37 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by HeyYou
...Higher the number, the lower the pressure in the manifold.
Our sensors measure pressure in inHg Absolute (inHgA), which makes that statement demonstrably false. So, I'll demonstrate.

Here I've removed my MAP sensor from the manifold and attached it to a vacuum pump with an inHg gauge.


As you can see, the inHg gauge reads zero, no vacuum.


The scan tool confirms that at 0 inHg (physical gauge) the sensor reads 30inHgA (sea level)


I draw 15.5inHg vacuum on the sensor


Map sensor reports pressure has fallen from 30 inHgA to 14 inHgA


Draw the vacuum down to 20 inHg vacuum


And the sensor reports 9 inHgA
 

Last edited by Prismatic; 07-09-2020 at 05:16 PM.


Quick Reply: Possible rich condition? Can someone help me read these O2 readings?



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:37 AM.