Anyone know what happens when two different keys are detected? Let's say I've got this system and one of you guys get in my truck with me, does it care that there are multiple keys in the truck? For that matter, could I start your truck with my key as long as your key is close enough?

 

Stupid iPhone, double post.

 

No, each key has its own transponder which are recorded in the trucks computer. Each key gives out a different frequency which must be programed to your truck by the dealer.

 

So does the key have to be in the ignition slot before it's read? Since all the keys are shaped the same, I'm just curious if mine would start your truck, if your key is in the truck with us.

I know it's slightly off topic but I'm curious.

 

Hang on a second here guys.

1. Does the Challenger have to have had its door locks opened by an authorized fob within x seconds of trying to push-button start it? If so, then there's not likely to be any "authentication" of the key fob being in the car. It already knows that Daddy is in the car because he opened the door.

2. If not, how does the Challenger know the guy pressing the button is Daddy? It must query if an authorized fob is in the car, which means the fob has to listen for the ping. That would kill the battery very quickly.

Even so, you would have to defeat the mechanism of moving the key to the "on" position to power everything up in the RAM. It can already be remotely started (if equipped), but not driven away until the key is inserted and moved to the "on" position.

All in all, for the sake of a straightforward software resequencing, this seems eminently possible to me, but economically unfeasible to retrofit. Even if you could, it seems less cool than remote starting the truck to me. Don't even have to unlocked the thing. Actually, can't have unlocked it.

 

I just went out to my wife's truck and placed her key on the dash and mine in the ignition. Wont start and said Invalid Key on the EVAC display. So I guess that answers that.

 

Interesting, thanks for trying that.

 

Here is some information on the keys. The truck uses a wireless signal to communicate with the key. The wrong key in the ignition will not start the truck.

DESCRIPTION


The Sentry Key Immobilizer System (SKIS) has a transponder chip included on the circuit board beneath the cover of each FOB with Integrated Key (FOBIK) (1) included with the vehicle. The FOBIK includes an integral mechanical valet key which is stored within the bottom of the FOBIK housing until it is released using the latch button (2). The valet key is cut to match the mechanical coding of the door and glove box lock cylinders. Each new replacement FOBIK must be programmed for operation of the Remote Keyless Entry (RKE) system and has a unique transponder identification code that is permanently programmed into it by the manufacturer. This identification code must be programmed into the Wireless Ignition Node (WIN) to be recognized by the SKIS as a valid key.

The FOBIK transponder cannot be adjusted or repaired. If ineffective or damaged, the entire FOBIK and RKE transmitter unit must be replaced.

OPERATION

When the ignition switch is turned to the ON position, the Wireless Ignition Node (WIN) communicates through its antenna with the Sentry Key transponder within the FOB with Integrated Key (FOBIK) using a Low Frequency (LF) signal. The Sentry Key transponder chip is within the range of the WIN transceiver antenna ring when it is inserted into the ignition switch.
The WIN determines whether a valid FOBIK is present in the ignition switch based upon the signal from the transponder. If a valid FOBIK is detected, that fact is communicated by the WIN to the Powertrain Control Module (PCM) over the Controller Area Network (CAN) data bus, and the PCM allows the engine to start. If the PCM receives an invalid key message, or receives no message from the WIN over the CAN data bus, the engine will be disabled. The ElectroMechanical Instrument Cluster (EMIC) (also known as the Cab Compartment Node/CCN) will also respond to the invalid key message on the CAN data bus by flashing the security indicator ON and OFF.
Each Sentry Key FOBIK has a unique transponder identification code permanently programmed into it by the manufacturer. Likewise, the WIN has a unique Secret Key code programmed into it by the manufacturer. When a Sentry Key FOBIK is programmed into the memory of the WIN, the WIN stores the transponder identification code from the Sentry Key FOBIK and the Sentry Key FOBIK learns the Secret Key code from the WIN. Once the Sentry Key FOBIK learns the Secret Key code of the WIN, it is permanently stored in the memory of the transponder. Therefore, once a FOBIK has been programmed to a particular vehicle, it cannot be used on any other vehicle.

 

Here is what the Challenger guy wrote. His writing is in red.

I work for the company that makes the Driver Authorization System (Keyless Go) for the Challenger, as well other platforms. It is a colpicated system. But adding it to your car can be done. In fact. I have the only Challenger SE on the road with keyless go installed! I just installed it this weekend. keyless Go is not even an option with the SE!
To dispel any myths, here is what is needed:

EVIC: does not matter. That is just for display. Without EVIC, everything works just fine. When you press the button once, all your accessories will come on. A second press and the car will start.

The WIN: (Wireless Ignition Node) also does not matter. Any WIN will work. We have a WIN.

The FOBIKs: there are 2 types of FOBIKS. If your car did not come with Keyless Go, then you have BASE FOBIKS. They will never work with KG. You have to have Keyless Go Fobiks. The KG FOBIKS have more electronics inside that receive commands from the PEM (Passive Entry Module) We would need these. Should be easy enough.

PEM: You need a PEM installed on the CAB B Bus for the system to work. The PEM is attached to 2 LF antenna's. 1 under the back seat and 1 in the IP. Here is a big issue. The Ram does not have a CAB B bus. We have a CAN C bus. So, even though they have different names, a bus is a bus right? We should still be able to splice it in, right? I wouldn't know where to start. Since it is not an option on Rams there is not going to be an empty plug somewhere to just hook it up. We would most likely need a complicated cutting and splicing of our wiring harness for this to work. It would need a power supply and a communication link to the PCM (I think it is the PCM the PEM is going to talk to, or, the PEM talks to the WIN and the WIN talks to the PCM. Any way you look at it, there needs to be communications between these modules to allow the truck to start). Without the PCM knowing that the key is in the truck, the little push button switch will do nothing, not to mention that our ignition switch may not even be the same.

How it all works:
With the Keyless Go Fobik inside the car, when you press the Start/Stop Button (SSB), the PEM send a command out of the LF antennas to find a kitted FOBIK inside the vehicle. If a Kittee FOBIK hears the PEM request, it transmits to the WIN and will allow the car to start. Simple as that.

If you wish to add this feature to your car, it is difficult beacause you need the right tools. Any Chrysler Service department can do this.

1st, you need the proper FOBIKS. The ones you want are Chrysler part# 05026457AF (Latest Revision). They are KG.
2nd, you need a PEM. Any PEM will work. 05026443AF (Latest REV)
3rd, Start Stop Button.

As far as hardware goes, that is all that is needed.

Once installed, the dealership can use the startscan tool to marry the new FOBIKS to the WIN and also transfer the info to the PEM. Then it will work fine.

Bear in mind that these instructions are only for the 8 cylinder engines. Remember that KG is not an option on the 6 cylinder engine. The WIN will send an AF command when the SSB is pressed, to the Engine computer to start it. Sending an AF command to the 3.5L will not start it. To put this system into the 3.5L, the WIN has to be modified (flashed) with a prototype software. This software was from Chrysler when they were considering this as an option of the 3.5L engine. Biggest issue. Since our trucks do not have Keyless Go for an option, there is no software out there for our WINs. Plus, I think our PCMs would need a flash to accept a communication signal from the WIN/PEM/whatever. Without the PCM knowing the Keyless Go system is installed, it won't work.

If anyone is interested in how this is all done, be happy to answer any questions about it.

I am not going to say it can't be done, but don't hold your breathe. It is not a simple wiring issue, there is software involved. Since this is not an option for our trucks, there is no software out there to use.

Simply put, this is not a plug and play system. It would be like putting new hardware, a webcam, hard drive, etc on your computer, but not giving your computer any software to run the hardware.

But then again, I may be wrong. I just read my service manual and am going by what the Challenger guy posted.

 

Why not just ask the Challenger guy who has all the knowledge if he knows how or if it's realistically feasible on our Rams with remote start?

Jason