+1

very well said

 

again, im not trying to bust on union workers, just the unions who arent willing to work with the govt...well, arent willing to listen to the govts demands.

 

My dad was an auto engineer for 20 year. He worked for an independent company the Big 3 would contract work to be done (seat mechanisms, door hinges, parking brakes, etc). The stories he told me about trips to Detroit and how the Union people think their **** smells like roses. Yes, the epitaph for Unions is being written and those a$$hats are cutting off their noses to spite their faces.

 

I'm a unionized engineer for a utility (not an automaker's union), and I think my 4 year engineering degree and job complexity makes my wage 100% justified; the same with the certified welders and pipefitters and linemen I work with.

One of the main reasons that non-union pay and benefits are so good is because from the employer's perspective, a very possible alternative is labor organization and eventually a major union setting up within the company. Better for them to volunteer competitive benefits and pay, rather than risk the chance of negotiations, strikes, lockouts, etc...

So before you go around bashing, consider that your employers aren't giving you competitve benefits and pay because they love you so much, and are just really swell folks.

But I do see the other side; there is a *nightmare* of a contract negotiation dragging out in another division of my company.

I'm not sure I agree that the *claimed* wage levels at these plants is justified for the level of skill involved. In cases like this, where the survival of the company is on the line, it behooves the workers to take a hit. In Central NY, New Process Gear (now Magna Powertrain) has a very large facility that makes 4WD components for Chevy, Dodge and Ford. They took a MASSIVE pay cut to stay employed when the company said the factory was at risk of closing down. Massive...on the order of 30-50% less. Why? Because in a struggling northeastern economy, the pay still beat what they get from unemployment...and jobs are hard to find. Now 1,900 people in central NY are facing the loss of their sole customers. What is the UAW doing to stave off another possible shutdown? Talking about wage consessions. At least out here. they seem to have some sense about them.

Well I'd love to continue but my contract says I can leave at 4:30

 

^^There's skilled labor and trained monkeys. The UAW is the latter.

 

+1...

 

Yup, they aren't even qualified to be mechanics, and real mechanics don't even have a union.

Skilled trades don't even really have unions, those are more like brotherhoods(like the IBEW), much like the masons, except they don't have aristocrats making them look shady lol. Those brotherhoods and their members are well worth what they are paid because they do go through a lot to get where they are. Many of those trades have to go to school AND apprentice.

My dad is a teamster, and he makes pretty good money. He might not be the most skilled worker, but he makes up for it with how hard he works, and he has the damage to his body to prove it. I absolutely hate his union, because the are really good at cutting off their nose to spite their face. His union has brought him near bankruptcy twice, and everytime they return from a lengthy unnecessary strike, the employees get punished by the company, by way of losing things like the uniform service, safety awards etc. So my parents are just starting to climb out of debt from the last strike(about 10 years ago), they'll never clear the mortgage in their lifetime now, and dad has to wash his own work clothes and doesn't even get his annual safety awards anymore. Oh and from those strikes, he's never seen any better wages or benefits than what they already had. I just wanted to get that out there so people can see where my hatred comes from. Add that to the fact that it's hard to make it past the 3 month probation in most unionized workplaces because the company doesn't want you in the union.

 

Too bad this subject wouldn't get this much talk so fast in Brand News.

 

where is "brand news"?

 

The second forum from the top, lol.