DCX to invest $1Billion in St. Louis Plants
#11
12-14-2005, 07:13 PM
RE: DCX to invest $1Billion in St. Louis Plants
ORIGINAL: Spear_em
There is a problem with what you said. GM is making some cars without Chevy...such as: The Saturn Sky and The Pontiac Solstice (same platform) which in my opinion are very nice lil cars.
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/844DFBD4F7C547F59D81CCCC9D36AF85.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/55C7968043804BA497B368ED952033B8.jpg[/IMG]
There is a problem with what you said. GM is making some cars without Chevy...such as: The Saturn Sky and The Pontiac Solstice (same platform) which in my opinion are very nice lil cars.
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/844DFBD4F7C547F59D81CCCC9D36AF85.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/55C7968043804BA497B368ED952033B8.jpg[/IMG]
#12
12-14-2005, 07:25 PM
#13
12-14-2005, 07:39 PM
The Only Elite DF Member
#14
12-14-2005, 07:43 PM
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#15
12-14-2005, 07:46 PM
Record Breaker
RE: DCX to invest $1Billion in St. Louis Plants
ORIGINAL: Spear_em
There is a problem with what you said. GM is making some cars without Chevy...such as: The Saturn Sky and The Pontiac Solstice (same platform) which in my opinion are very nice lil cars.
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/844DFBD4F7C547F59D81CCCC9D36AF85.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/55C7968043804BA497B368ED952033B8.jpg[/IMG]
ORIGINAL: 97 3.5 Intrepid
" I think much of GMs problem is Chevy gets everything. If they would give Pontiac, Buick, or Saturn the effort that they give Chevy, I believe the company could turn around."
" I think much of GMs problem is Chevy gets everything. If they would give Pontiac, Buick, or Saturn the effort that they give Chevy, I believe the company could turn around."
There is a problem with what you said. GM is making some cars without Chevy...such as: The Saturn Sky and The Pontiac Solstice (same platform) which in my opinion are very nice lil cars.
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/844DFBD4F7C547F59D81CCCC9D36AF85.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/55C7968043804BA497B368ED952033B8.jpg[/IMG]
DevilsReject, although I agree with you on offering a version in Pontiac to compete against the SRTs and SVTs, I disagree with you on merging Buick and Chevy. In terms of economics and marketing, Chevy is considered to be an inferior product and Buikc is considered to be a superior product. No matter how nice you make Chevy, it will still be viewed upon as being a cheap, base model brand because it has been established as that and once a brand has been established as that, it is almost impossible to change that image. The issue is Buick has a better chance of attracting people away from Japanese cars because Japanese cars are considered to be a superior product. When people make more money, the demand for superior products increase and the demand for inferior products decrease. These people will not upgrade to a Cadillac because Cadillac is more than what they can afford for now. They will not purchase a Saab because Saab must be too superior to these peoples' minds as well. If GM intends to keep Saturn as another division that is full of rebadged cars then I agree they should be dropped. If they are going to keep them, they need to be seperate in their marketing stragey. I would like to see pics on the G6 V8 coupe because I have heard nothing about this. I agree one of the two truck divisions should be shut down but I'd prefer it be the Chevy division because I think GMC has better styling. I can't image that Chevy fans would have problems getting a GMC but I can image GMC fans having problems getting a Chevy. Many GMC fans hate Chevy's grille designs and GMC is also considered to be a superior product because some of their vehicles are classified as luxury vehicles whereas the Chevy version is not considered to be luxurious
#16
12-14-2005, 07:50 PM
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RE: DCX to invest $1Billion in St. Louis Plants
ORIGINAL: MidnightBlueNeon
I disagree, those are 2 of the ugliest cars GM ever made!
ORIGINAL: Spear_em
There is a problem with what you said. GM is making some cars without Chevy...such as: The Saturn Sky and The Pontiac Solstice (same platform) which in my opinion are very nice lil cars.
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/844DFBD4F7C547F59D81CCCC9D36AF85.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/55C7968043804BA497B368ED952033B8.jpg[/IMG]
There is a problem with what you said. GM is making some cars without Chevy...such as: The Saturn Sky and The Pontiac Solstice (same platform) which in my opinion are very nice lil cars.
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/844DFBD4F7C547F59D81CCCC9D36AF85.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/55C7968043804BA497B368ED952033B8.jpg[/IMG]
#17
12-14-2005, 07:50 PM
Record Breaker
RE: DCX to invest $1Billion in St. Louis Plants
ORIGINAL: Spear_em
Dude; ITS THE SAME CAR!!!
ORIGINAL: nickoman01
me too, but the solosist does nothing fro me.
ORIGINAL: DevilsReject
I like the Saturn Sky, reminds me of a Vauxhall 220.
I like the Saturn Sky, reminds me of a Vauxhall 220.
me too, but the solosist does nothing fro me.
#18
12-14-2005, 08:22 PM
RE: DCX to invest $1Billion in St. Louis Plants
ORIGINAL: 97 3.5 Intrepid
My point is Chevy gets most of the effort. Let's look at what Chevy has that no other division has. It has the Corvette, the Pontiac performance division doesn't have its own version, it has the Monte Carlo, the GP coupe is gone, and it has the PT Cruiser rip-off HHR, no other GM divison has their own version. So Pontiac and Saturn get to share the Solstice/Sky, it does not compare to the Corvette in its significance, nor does it compare against the Monte Carlo in terms of performance. The Pontiac G6 coupe would help to make up some of the difference for not having their own version of the Monte Carlo anymore, but it wouldn't be as fast. Again, Pontiac and Saturn have to share that car where as Chevy gets their own special cars. Don't be surprised if Chevy gets their own version before it's all over. The GTO isn't as special as the Corvette nor as fast. Pontiac does not have their own version of the Cobalt/Ion yet either and I'm sure they're going to lose some Sunfire fans.
DevilsReject, although I agree with you on offering a version in Pontiac to compete against the SRTs and SVTs, I disagree with you on merging Buick and Chevy. In terms of economics and marketing, Chevy is considered to be an inferior product and Buikc is considered to be a superior product. No matter how nice you make Chevy, it will still be viewed upon as being a cheap, base model brand because it has been established as that and once a brand has been established as that, it is almost impossible to change that image. The issue is Buick has a better chance of attracting people away from Japanese cars because Japanese cars are considered to be a superior product. When people make more money, the demand for superior products increase and the demand for inferior products decrease. These people will not upgrade to a Cadillac because Cadillac is more than what they can afford for now. They will not purchase a Saab because Saab must be too superior to these peoples' minds as well. If GM intends to keep Saturn as another division that is full of rebadged cars then I agree they should be dropped. If they are going to keep them, they need to be seperate in their marketing stragey. I would like to see pics on the G6 V8 coupe because I have heard nothing about this. I agree one of the two truck divisions should be shut down but I'd prefer it be the Chevy division because I think GMC has better styling. I can't image that Chevy fans would have problems getting a GMC but I can image GMC fans having problems getting a Chevy. Many GMC fans hate Chevy's grille designs and GMC is also considered to be a superior product because some of their vehicles are classified as luxury vehicles whereas the Chevy version is not considered to be luxurious
My point is Chevy gets most of the effort. Let's look at what Chevy has that no other division has. It has the Corvette, the Pontiac performance division doesn't have its own version, it has the Monte Carlo, the GP coupe is gone, and it has the PT Cruiser rip-off HHR, no other GM divison has their own version. So Pontiac and Saturn get to share the Solstice/Sky, it does not compare to the Corvette in its significance, nor does it compare against the Monte Carlo in terms of performance. The Pontiac G6 coupe would help to make up some of the difference for not having their own version of the Monte Carlo anymore, but it wouldn't be as fast. Again, Pontiac and Saturn have to share that car where as Chevy gets their own special cars. Don't be surprised if Chevy gets their own version before it's all over. The GTO isn't as special as the Corvette nor as fast. Pontiac does not have their own version of the Cobalt/Ion yet either and I'm sure they're going to lose some Sunfire fans.
DevilsReject, although I agree with you on offering a version in Pontiac to compete against the SRTs and SVTs, I disagree with you on merging Buick and Chevy. In terms of economics and marketing, Chevy is considered to be an inferior product and Buikc is considered to be a superior product. No matter how nice you make Chevy, it will still be viewed upon as being a cheap, base model brand because it has been established as that and once a brand has been established as that, it is almost impossible to change that image. The issue is Buick has a better chance of attracting people away from Japanese cars because Japanese cars are considered to be a superior product. When people make more money, the demand for superior products increase and the demand for inferior products decrease. These people will not upgrade to a Cadillac because Cadillac is more than what they can afford for now. They will not purchase a Saab because Saab must be too superior to these peoples' minds as well. If GM intends to keep Saturn as another division that is full of rebadged cars then I agree they should be dropped. If they are going to keep them, they need to be seperate in their marketing stragey. I would like to see pics on the G6 V8 coupe because I have heard nothing about this. I agree one of the two truck divisions should be shut down but I'd prefer it be the Chevy division because I think GMC has better styling. I can't image that Chevy fans would have problems getting a GMC but I can image GMC fans having problems getting a Chevy. Many GMC fans hate Chevy's grille designs and GMC is also considered to be a superior product because some of their vehicles are classified as luxury vehicles whereas the Chevy version is not considered to be luxurious
As far as Chevy having more cars, well what do you expect? Pontiac hasnt had a performance car in years, this isnt anything new. The best performance car they've had in my lifetime has been the Firebird/Trans-Am, and it wasnt even as good as the current GTO. The GTO is pretty close to the Vette, maybe not the Z06, but definitely the base model. The Monte Carlo has been a joke for about 20 years now. The last version IMO, to be worth a crap was the 80's model SuperSport. Since then, it's been one big crapola. The only other major car was discontinued, and even then, Pontiac had its own version of it. For all the "performance" you claim Pontiac to have, they've never really had a car all to themselves. Least, not in recent years. I'd say the GTO is probably the closest thing to it. Meaning, it was exclusive to Pontiac and only Pontiac, not these cross platform, cross Brand cars like the Camaro/Firebird/Trans-Am.
As for the Regal/Chevy merger....it was merely to utilize the best of Buick. They no longer produce coupes, and they have essentially become the cheapo line of Cadillacs for GM. I love Buicks, great cars. I just don't see them being able to sustain themselves on 2-3 sedans that are all cross-brand platforms and those two hideous SUV's that are also cross-brand platformed. Chevy needs to lose some cars and move the Buick Sedans into its lineup.
I also too feel that it should be a GMC truck and Chevy cars.... I think they do make the better of the two. So we are definitely in agreement there.
GTO = Vette
G6 = Monte Carlo
Bonneville GTP = Impala SS
Grand Prix GTP = Cobalt SS
I really shouldnt say equal, but they are close. Truth is, every major car brand is setup like Chevy. They have the major power car in one lineup, and not in the other. The only real exception to that rule currently, is Nissan's 350Z and Infiniti's I35. Same car, chassis, engine, different body panels.
Ford has its Mustang, Chevy has the Corvette, Dodge has the Viper, Acura has the NSX
None of those cars appear in any shape or form in another lineup, its not exclusive to GM. I agree with where you are going though, I definitely think you have the right ideas on some of this.
#19
12-15-2005, 12:39 AM
RE: DCX to invest $1Billion in St. Louis Plants
ORIGINAL: Spear_em
Nah; the HHR is the UGLIEST thing GM ever made! You just dont have any taste!
ORIGINAL: MidnightBlueNeon
I disagree, those are 2 of the ugliest cars GM ever made!
ORIGINAL: Spear_em
There is a problem with what you said. GM is making some cars without Chevy...such as: The Saturn Sky and The Pontiac Solstice (same platform) which in my opinion are very nice lil cars.
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/844DFBD4F7C547F59D81CCCC9D36AF85.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/55C7968043804BA497B368ED952033B8.jpg[/IMG]
There is a problem with what you said. GM is making some cars without Chevy...such as: The Saturn Sky and The Pontiac Solstice (same platform) which in my opinion are very nice lil cars.
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/844DFBD4F7C547F59D81CCCC9D36AF85.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]local://upfiles/11859/55C7968043804BA497B368ED952033B8.jpg[/IMG]
#20
12-15-2005, 01:04 AM