Band on tour needs help!! Engine just shuts off!
#1
07-14-2010 | 07:40 PM
Thread Starter
|
Amateur
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
From: Franklin, IN
Band on tour needs help!! Engine just shuts off!
I'm in a touring band.
look at my user name, thats what we have as far as van is concerned, lol.
anyway, our van just dies. On the highway cruisng, its fine. But slowing into traffic, itll just die sometime. after letting it sit for a while (30-40 min) it starts just fine. rarely we have to use a little starting spray.
Example, and this is what happens most of the time:
We were driving from peru Indiana to chicago (3-4 hours) and all the highway traffic up I65 was just fine. we cruised comfortably at 65-70 mph, no probs. but, one we hit a traffic jam and slowed / stopped started the probs. See for a while it was cool. but after about 20-30 min of slow traffic speed / stopping, it died. on the skyway. scary. so we let it sit for about 30-40 min, and we were back on the road. well, once we got though some lights and traffic downtown, welp, it happened again. a couple of times in secession.
This is the kind of story about every time it happens. I can give more details if need be! its been going on for a while, and im sick of it!
But it ONLY does this when its really hot out, never in the spring / fall / winter. Totally confused.
I know some car stuff, please help - we have a tour soon beginning with a trip from Indy straight to a festival in Montana!
look at my user name, thats what we have as far as van is concerned, lol.
anyway, our van just dies. On the highway cruisng, its fine. But slowing into traffic, itll just die sometime. after letting it sit for a while (30-40 min) it starts just fine. rarely we have to use a little starting spray.
Example, and this is what happens most of the time:
We were driving from peru Indiana to chicago (3-4 hours) and all the highway traffic up I65 was just fine. we cruised comfortably at 65-70 mph, no probs. but, one we hit a traffic jam and slowed / stopped started the probs. See for a while it was cool. but after about 20-30 min of slow traffic speed / stopping, it died. on the skyway. scary. so we let it sit for about 30-40 min, and we were back on the road. well, once we got though some lights and traffic downtown, welp, it happened again. a couple of times in secession.
This is the kind of story about every time it happens. I can give more details if need be! its been going on for a while, and im sick of it!
But it ONLY does this when its really hot out, never in the spring / fall / winter. Totally confused.
I know some car stuff, please help - we have a tour soon beginning with a trip from Indy straight to a festival in Montana!
#2
07-14-2010 | 10:10 PM
Van & CUV Section Moderator
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 5,237
Likes: 96
My first thought is the ignition coil is bad. You mentioned at times starting fluid will make it go, this tells me the spark is weak. Starting fluid has a lower flash point than gas. So a weak spark can ignite starting fluid even though it doesn't ignite gas.
Also, at slower speeds the alternator power output drops 10%-20% lower than what you'll get at highway speeds. As a direct result, the power to the coil drops this same 10%-20% which can drop you below the threshold of having a spark strong enough to fire the gas.
After sitting a while the coil has had a chance to cool a bit and the power output goes up to the point where it can once again ignite gas.
Of course I could be wrong, so if anyone else has a better idea, speak up.
Also, at slower speeds the alternator power output drops 10%-20% lower than what you'll get at highway speeds. As a direct result, the power to the coil drops this same 10%-20% which can drop you below the threshold of having a spark strong enough to fire the gas.
After sitting a while the coil has had a chance to cool a bit and the power output goes up to the point where it can once again ignite gas.
Of course I could be wrong, so if anyone else has a better idea, speak up.
Last edited by alloro; 07-14-2010 at 10:12 PM.
#3
07-14-2010 | 11:20 PM
Thread Starter
|
Amateur
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
From: Franklin, IN
My first thought is the ignition coil is bad. You mentioned at times starting fluid will make it go, this tells me the spark is weak. Starting fluid has a lower flash point than gas. So a weak spark can ignite starting fluid even though it doesn't ignite gas.
Also, at slower speeds the alternator power output drops 10%-20% lower than what you'll get at highway speeds. As a direct result, the power to the coil drops this same 10%-20% which can drop you below the threshold of having a spark strong enough to fire the gas.
After sitting a while the coil has had a chance to cool a bit and the power output goes up to the point where it can once again ignite gas.
Of course I could be wrong, so if anyone else has a better idea, speak up.
Also, at slower speeds the alternator power output drops 10%-20% lower than what you'll get at highway speeds. As a direct result, the power to the coil drops this same 10%-20% which can drop you below the threshold of having a spark strong enough to fire the gas.
After sitting a while the coil has had a chance to cool a bit and the power output goes up to the point where it can once again ignite gas.
Of course I could be wrong, so if anyone else has a better idea, speak up.
here's some things ive been pondering after looking at other posts in a addition what you just said:
asd or pcm? or egr?
also, were doing a full tune up. thanks for your help, your helping my whole band out!
#4
07-14-2010 | 11:26 PM
Record Breaker
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,146
Likes: 1
The coil sounds like a good culprit.
I would also be interested in the battery temp and voltage when this occurs. If the battery has an an intermittant shorting cell, excessive temps would aggravate it. Just the lack of cooling air at traffic speeds, after highway driving, might have the voltage drop to below 11.5, at which point the engine runs crusty. Throw a weak coil on top of that... stall.
I would also want to check the resistance on the 2 wire Coolant temp sensor. On mine there is also a throttle body temp sensor. Somebody here or over there, had a similar issue and found this Air charge temp sensor to be the culprit, not too long ago.
I looked and could not find the thread.
A couple other possibilities are a stuck open EGR valve( if so equipped), or a partially clogged cat con, failing fuel pump.
I would also be interested in the battery temp and voltage when this occurs. If the battery has an an intermittant shorting cell, excessive temps would aggravate it. Just the lack of cooling air at traffic speeds, after highway driving, might have the voltage drop to below 11.5, at which point the engine runs crusty. Throw a weak coil on top of that... stall.
I would also want to check the resistance on the 2 wire Coolant temp sensor. On mine there is also a throttle body temp sensor. Somebody here or over there, had a similar issue and found this Air charge temp sensor to be the culprit, not too long ago.
I looked and could not find the thread.
A couple other possibilities are a stuck open EGR valve( if so equipped), or a partially clogged cat con, failing fuel pump.
Last edited by landyacht318; 07-14-2010 at 11:39 PM.
#5
07-14-2010 | 11:51 PM
Thread Starter
|
Amateur
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
From: Franklin, IN
The coil sounds like a good culprit.
I would also be interested in the battery temp and voltage when this occurs. If the battery has an an intermittant shorting cell, excessive temps would aggravate it. Just the lack of cooling air at traffic speeds, after highway driving, might have the voltage drop to below 11.5, at which point the engine runs crusty. Throw a weak coil on top of that... stall.
I would also want to check the resistance on the 2 wire Coolant temp sensor. On mine there is also a throttle body temp sensor. Somebody here or over there, had a similar issue and found this Air charge temp sensor to be the culprit, not too long ago.
I looked and could not find the thread.
A couple other possibilities are a stuck open EGR valve( if so equipped), or a partially clogged cat con, failing fuel pump.
I would also be interested in the battery temp and voltage when this occurs. If the battery has an an intermittant shorting cell, excessive temps would aggravate it. Just the lack of cooling air at traffic speeds, after highway driving, might have the voltage drop to below 11.5, at which point the engine runs crusty. Throw a weak coil on top of that... stall.
I would also want to check the resistance on the 2 wire Coolant temp sensor. On mine there is also a throttle body temp sensor. Somebody here or over there, had a similar issue and found this Air charge temp sensor to be the culprit, not too long ago.
I looked and could not find the thread.
A couple other possibilities are a stuck open EGR valve( if so equipped), or a partially clogged cat con, failing fuel pump.
ya we unplugged a 3 or 4 prong thingy to the right of the air filter pan (if your looking down from the drivers seat) i think it does something with the throttle or whatev. every now and then that helps. but this problem in general happens so rarely, i dunno if that really is a factor or not.
#6
07-15-2010 | 12:07 AM
Record Breaker
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,146
Likes: 1
Have you checked for any stored computer codes? Search for "key dance" to retrieve them, them post them here.
3 or 4 prong thingy? come on man. These might be either the Map sensor or the throttle position sensors. Unplugging and replugging them shouldn't have any effect on your symptoms. If wiggling them while trying to start the engine has no effect, then it is co-incidence that unplugging and replugging them, does anything.
Even if they are loose/ bad connections, they would not prevent it from starting, IMO.
3 or 4 prong thingy? come on man. These might be either the Map sensor or the throttle position sensors. Unplugging and replugging them shouldn't have any effect on your symptoms. If wiggling them while trying to start the engine has no effect, then it is co-incidence that unplugging and replugging them, does anything.
Even if they are loose/ bad connections, they would not prevent it from starting, IMO.
#7
07-15-2010 | 12:09 AM
Thread Starter
|
Amateur
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
From: Franklin, IN
Have you checked for any stored computer codes? Search for "key dance" to retrieve them, them post them here.
3 or 4 prong thingy? come on man. These might be either the Map sensor or the throttle position sensors. Unplugging and replugging them shouldn't have any effect on your symptoms. If wiggling them while trying to start the engine has no effect, then it is co-incidence that unplugging and replugging them, does anything.
Even if they are loose/ bad connections, they would not prevent it from starting, IMO.
3 or 4 prong thingy? come on man. These might be either the Map sensor or the throttle position sensors. Unplugging and replugging them shouldn't have any effect on your symptoms. If wiggling them while trying to start the engine has no effect, then it is co-incidence that unplugging and replugging them, does anything.
Even if they are loose/ bad connections, they would not prevent it from starting, IMO.
thats what i figured, but hey, on tour, you have to try something! lol. :P
ya, im going to try and get the codes for you guys.
Trending Topics
#9
07-15-2010 | 01:04 AM
Van & CUV Section Moderator
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 5,237
Likes: 96
#10
07-15-2010 | 01:19 AM
Thread Starter
|
Amateur
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
From: Franklin, IN