I wasn't mad at all and I wasn't trying to jump down your throat sorry. It's just alot of people on this site keep going on about backpressure and things like that when if they did their research they'd find out that no back presure is the best backpressure. I would think the best exhaust system would be a set of longtube headers conected with a y-pipe and then having maybe a 3 foot 3" pipe and nothing else. This way your getting the scavanging affects from the headers and there is no restrictions in the system at all. The reason we don't do this is because of the noise and the exhaust finding its way back into the cab. Think of the exhaust system as a straw. If you put the straw in water and then plug one end the water stays inthere. It's the same with your exhaust if there is a bottleneck anywhere in the system it will affect the entire system. By going to larger pipe behind the muffler theretically you will be creating a bottleneck because the exhaust gas will cool down and slow down. Once the exhaust gets to the atmosphere it no longer affects the system. Will you notice the bottle neck behind the muffler? Probably not becaue you'll be taking out one of the bigger restriction the muffler. This increase will also be noticed when replacing the cat.

Sorry for any mispelling or poor grammer. It's early in the morinng and I don't have any time during the day to post anymore. So I'm trying to hurry.

 

Haha, its cool ICEMAN_CH,and I wasnt trying implying that you jumped down my throat. From hankL's information (thanks) and ICEMAN_CH's, the least restriction is a good thing. But at what point in the exhaust system does that matter. We already know that stock size out of the cat is 2.5" which will still be retained. 2.25" pipes are still allowing for major expansion as well as the 2.5" duals would,as it will be double in size (combined output)after the y pipe. Would that not be equivelant to dumping the exhaust since it can't fill 5" of pipe as itjust wants to fill 2.5" stock? As mentioned earlier, 3"is the max for the 360 single. even @ 2.25" with 2 pipes = 4.5" total output size.Im already1.5" above max output for a 360 for those pipes, and i have the 318.

 

WOW !!! very intresting ... as i have more experience then all with changing exhaust , but ill keep my findings to myself... look at the guys that run 3" pipe and the location where they live....i felt more at 1500-2500 rpm with 3" pipe with dual 2.5" then i did with stock 2.5" or single 2.5" ,dual 2.5" or 2.5" with gibson , flowmaster , magnaflow , xlerator , flopro.. should i go on ??? cause i will go with you all , all day long... going from a 2.5" to a dual 2.25" does not make you think you know better about exhaust..

 

Ahhhh, this is another good point. Altitude. More so on the intake side, but what you intake, you also exhaust. Perhaps this is why i felt 3" was too much on my truck.
But PA, didn't you change your exhaust back to 2.5" from 3". I though we had had this discussion not long ago, and you agreed that it helped your truck and you thought it would be a good idea on my truck. Maybe i'm thinking of someone else.

 

That was exactly my point though. I said 2.25" makes most sense for a true dual. BUT, if your running a fake dual, then 2.50" is fine. I'm not going to get into a fight about this, but everyone just reads too much into this exhaust crap. It's just a fake 2.50" dual from the cat ppl, thats not a big deal. Gains are going to be minimal across the boards anyways, we all know that like I said before. All exhaust systems have their sweet spots as we have all indicated. Some are geared for torque, some for mid range and upper range. Obviously PC told us he wants some torque, so if you really want the torque or don't want to risk loosing the existing torque you have now, then sure, go with the 2.25". I just think if your going to do an exhaust system, you might as well get it done right and get the best overal median. If you loose a little torque, your going to be talking MINIMAL, I dont know why everyone insists this is a big deal. While you may loose a tad torque, your mid ranger and upper end will accell, but again all in all, it's going to be minimal. Look at my situation for christ sakes, I'm running a complete 3" system right now from the header collectors back, and that would be considered WAY OVERSIZED. And guess what, my 0-60 lost about a 1/2 second, but guess what also, my mid ranger and upper end got much better. I dont even have an intake or a bigger throttle body, and my truck was hardly affected. So remember, exhaust system gains and losses are going to be minimal in the first place. That system you have in mind is a nice system, and I think if you slap that nice mandrel bent 2.50" system from the catback, your truck will see improvements across the board, but again, nothin too big. Everoyne can get their pants up in a bunch over a catback system, but really, not that big of a deal fellas. To top it off, if you put in intake on your truck (or if you already have one) and then a fastman, it will be even better. Everyone...relax, 2.50" catback system, perfectly fine...that's my 2 cents. Everyone has their own opinion, but here is mine opinion[8D].

 

You are correct silver...each person or truck its gonna be different .. for example .. me and silver are neighbors ( god help us) same truck same year same exhaust with the same mods.. guess what ,heloves what he did to his exhaust, on another hand i felt like something is missing .. ??? i can sit here all day and say go with 3" dual 2.5" and u will love it..NOT !!! whatworks for me will not work for you... my stock 96 after the cat came with 2.75" stock with 2.5" single out.....Like i said my truck pullsfrom 1500-2500 rpm and i seem to hit a wall at 3000rpm.. But i will say this if your not gonna do anymore mods , im talking about serious mods stay away from long tubes..

here is a question for neon.. why did you go with the long tube headers ???

 

Well I appreciate you opinion. And as far as this entire discussion goesI consider it fufilled so continue if you must, but it has served its purpose in my book. Thanks everyone. Sorry 20DodgeNeon00, but I have 2 do it. lol... Just as the bold says... "I just think if your going to do an exhaust system, you might as well get it done right....." AHAHAHAHAH lol... should'a installed them headers yourself.But you did admit that you lost some torque, but now you say that it isn't a big deal. As I recall at first, you were extremely pissed! You hoped you would gain (as well as I would have thought to happen). Either way man im just busting your ***** a bit there. It was ment as a joke.

 

After the reviews I've read about the Pacesetter long tubes I'm staying the hell away from them and investing my money in more of a quality product. I'm thinking Gibson stainless steel shorties. Skylined said he had all kind of trouble with leaks in the Y-pipe and I remember when they were originally shipped they were all ****ed up to begin with. Plus thestupid ceramic coating thats $200hasto be stripped off to weld them, and I don't really feel likeputting band clamps on a$700 exhaust system.

 

Actually, my truck is a '99 and I have 1.7's and a B&G flash, but otherwise, same.

 

Personally, I feel bad how I gave such initial bad bad press on the pacesetter longtubes. My enjoyment of them has been completely sapped because of the jerkoff job I got from the mechanic. The truck is currently being fixed right now and all leaks are going to be addressed. I also told him the y-pipe isn't the best of quality, and to do what he can do to make the leaks go away. But beside that, I just have to bring it back home that these headers are very badass. They make the truck sound amazing, and I actually have a mid range and upper end now. Now for the torque, any longtube header is going to make you loose torque, and me, I really didn't know how much. Like I said to varify this, I had a 8 second 0-60 without the headers, and now I have 8.5-9 second 0-60. But still, I cannot completely confirm this seeing I have had so many variables and obstacles this last week interfering with that (air in the coolant system, cat put right after passenger collector headers, exhaust leaks, and truck running rough). When I get my truck back, I am going to do a complete whole new line of tests. As it stands now, even with all those ****ty variables the truck still runs an impressive 0-60, and thats with nothing done to the engine keep in mind. So again, sorry if I have scared people off with the headers, its my fault, the headers themselves rock, but some symptoms I got stuck with tainted the whole header experience on me. I am anxtious to get my truck back and relive the beautiness of badass longtube headers on a badass truck, I'll let you all know how the truck runs and performs with all the variables fixed!