Road trip emergency
Record Breaker
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,680
Likes: 0
From: Allentown, PA
You can get pretty good heads off of ebay for a decent price. But as Nice said, stay away from junk yards unless you know what your looking at. Might be worth grabbing some heads from a junk yard and taking them to a shop and see how they are ,though, depending on price of heads and shop.
Might be time to throw a 408 stroker in that baby
, never will complain about loss of power then. BTW, what part of pa r ya from.
Might be time to throw a 408 stroker in that baby
, never will complain about loss of power then. BTW, what part of pa r ya from.
Hall Of Fame
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 12,204
Likes: 10
From: Gainesville, Ga.
Hi Jen the daughter. welcome to DF. we've all been following your story and we're glad you made it home safe and sound. it really stinks being stranded out on the highway.
so here's what likely happened to your truck. your fuel pump got noisy, probably on its way out, and you noticed that in the loud whine. while you're in oklahoma, the pump failed and it began starving for gas and running poorly. this makes the truck run lean and also creates more heat in the cylinders. your head gasket may or may not have failed at this point. the oklahoma shop diagnoses the fuel pump. we'll assume they were right because it seemed to fix your most obvious set of problems. a fuel pressure test would identify it as bad or not. they probably charged you about $350 for the pump (they are expensive) and another 200 to install (about 2 hrs), and another 150 for the oil and atf change. you said your temperature was still normal at this point.... you might or might not have had a leaking head gasket. a compression test would identify whether you did or didn't. so you hit the road again. we'll assume the new fuel pump is ok, and you don't have a lean condition. when the temp went up, that was the beginning of the major malfunction. it could be that you simply had a leaking radiator hose, or you may have had a leaking head gasket, which increased temps and pressure, and eventually lead to the hose failure. no way to know for sure. at some point you pushed all your coolant out, and the temp gauge pegged. this extreme heat can cause severe damage to gaskets, heads, pistons, block, and/or everything else. now with the radiator hose fixed, its still running poorly.
looking back at post #1, it says you've got 200k miles on the motor. the next step is to run a compression test to see if any cylinders have little or no compression. after that, you could elect to tear down the original motor to determine if its repairable. or, you could just scrap that motor and proceed with a reman or a junkyard motor. i'd try to put as little money as possible in that original motor, as it could be a huge waste of time and money. the labor rate of tear down, extent of repair, and possible rebuild, possible new heads could end up costing more that a reman'ed motor. a good mechanic can swap your motor in as little as 4-5 hours, far less time than fixing the old one !!!!
your likely to spend a lot of money on this repair - and you want the outcome to be good, not a money pit that ends up being twice what you expect. a good (hard nosed) question to ask your mechanic is this -
1. what would you do if this was your mother's truck ?
2. if we do "this" how much will it cost ?
3. can you guarantee that if we do "this" and it costs "that much", the truck will run perfect for the next 1 year and 12,000 miles. if no guarantee - be careful.
edit - the truth is, prior to tear down, he cannot guarantee that he can fix it for a small amount. he'd would have to estimate on the worst case, or just guess based on experience. if he guesses low and turns out to be wrong, you don't want to become the victim.
here's what you DONT want to happen.
1. start a repair that's going to cost $500.
2. uh-oh, these heads, are cracked, its going to cost another $1000.
3. put it all back together and it runs like crap - uh oh, it looks like we need to pull the heads back out and replace the pistons, that'll be another 1000.
good luck.
so here's what likely happened to your truck. your fuel pump got noisy, probably on its way out, and you noticed that in the loud whine. while you're in oklahoma, the pump failed and it began starving for gas and running poorly. this makes the truck run lean and also creates more heat in the cylinders. your head gasket may or may not have failed at this point. the oklahoma shop diagnoses the fuel pump. we'll assume they were right because it seemed to fix your most obvious set of problems. a fuel pressure test would identify it as bad or not. they probably charged you about $350 for the pump (they are expensive) and another 200 to install (about 2 hrs), and another 150 for the oil and atf change. you said your temperature was still normal at this point.... you might or might not have had a leaking head gasket. a compression test would identify whether you did or didn't. so you hit the road again. we'll assume the new fuel pump is ok, and you don't have a lean condition. when the temp went up, that was the beginning of the major malfunction. it could be that you simply had a leaking radiator hose, or you may have had a leaking head gasket, which increased temps and pressure, and eventually lead to the hose failure. no way to know for sure. at some point you pushed all your coolant out, and the temp gauge pegged. this extreme heat can cause severe damage to gaskets, heads, pistons, block, and/or everything else. now with the radiator hose fixed, its still running poorly.
looking back at post #1, it says you've got 200k miles on the motor. the next step is to run a compression test to see if any cylinders have little or no compression. after that, you could elect to tear down the original motor to determine if its repairable. or, you could just scrap that motor and proceed with a reman or a junkyard motor. i'd try to put as little money as possible in that original motor, as it could be a huge waste of time and money. the labor rate of tear down, extent of repair, and possible rebuild, possible new heads could end up costing more that a reman'ed motor. a good mechanic can swap your motor in as little as 4-5 hours, far less time than fixing the old one !!!!
your likely to spend a lot of money on this repair - and you want the outcome to be good, not a money pit that ends up being twice what you expect. a good (hard nosed) question to ask your mechanic is this -
1. what would you do if this was your mother's truck ?
2. if we do "this" how much will it cost ?
3. can you guarantee that if we do "this" and it costs "that much", the truck will run perfect for the next 1 year and 12,000 miles. if no guarantee - be careful.
edit - the truth is, prior to tear down, he cannot guarantee that he can fix it for a small amount. he'd would have to estimate on the worst case, or just guess based on experience. if he guesses low and turns out to be wrong, you don't want to become the victim.
here's what you DONT want to happen.
1. start a repair that's going to cost $500.
2. uh-oh, these heads, are cracked, its going to cost another $1000.
3. put it all back together and it runs like crap - uh oh, it looks like we need to pull the heads back out and replace the pistons, that'll be another 1000.
good luck.
Last edited by dhvaughan; Apr 2, 2010 at 12:40 AM.
Banned
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 3,667
Likes: 1
From: Burnsville, mn - Pensacola, fl
Welcome to DF and i hope you plan on staying, along with your father.
This is my favorite part of your post
"when things break I fix what I'm told whats broken, hence the fuel pump. It whined so loud you could hear it inside the truck. Took it to the garage, and was told I was being a silly blonde, and its old and whines."
Im actually in the same boat you're in, "the fuel pump that is" i cant go over 60 any more, it's progressively getting slower and slower and harder to start as the days continue. But i dont have the cash right now to get a new pump and i know enough people "locally" that can give me a push if i need to get her home.
As far as them telling you it's normal for an old pump to be that loud, Ah no it's not and if i had been there i woulda pointed at him and laughed in his face, only time you're supposed to hear the pump is when you first turn the truck on, but in my case it sounds the same all the time, you turn the key on and it never stops sqeeking/humming and it's so loud i can hear it in my cab with my windows rolled up over my exhaust " loud exhaust ".
At this point i have no idea where im going with this post it's 12:45am here and i just got back from the races.
Anyways goodluck keep us posted and we would be greatful to have you and your father as perm guests
This is my favorite part of your post
"when things break I fix what I'm told whats broken, hence the fuel pump. It whined so loud you could hear it inside the truck. Took it to the garage, and was told I was being a silly blonde, and its old and whines."
Im actually in the same boat you're in, "the fuel pump that is" i cant go over 60 any more, it's progressively getting slower and slower and harder to start as the days continue. But i dont have the cash right now to get a new pump and i know enough people "locally" that can give me a push if i need to get her home.
As far as them telling you it's normal for an old pump to be that loud, Ah no it's not and if i had been there i woulda pointed at him and laughed in his face, only time you're supposed to hear the pump is when you first turn the truck on, but in my case it sounds the same all the time, you turn the key on and it never stops sqeeking/humming and it's so loud i can hear it in my cab with my windows rolled up over my exhaust " loud exhaust ".
At this point i have no idea where im going with this post it's 12:45am here and i just got back from the races.
Anyways goodluck keep us posted and we would be greatful to have you and your father as perm guests
Hello, Its Jen, the daughter. The truck got shipped near home, so now its the fun journey of finding exactly what happened. I have had this truck for 7 years, my first car, (truck). When I left PA, it ran fine, just a tick off center 200 degrees on the temp. Engine ran fine, tranny as well.
I'm not mechanically inclined, I train horses. But I am aware of any new noises or vibrations the truck makes, and so when things break I fix what I'm told whats broken, hence the fuel pump. It whined so loud you could hear it inside the truck. Took it to the garage, and was told I was being a silly blonde, and its old and whines.
So I get to OK from PA, and truck has no horsepower, shudders badly when driven, and sounds like the tranny cant decide a gear. It also slowed down to the point where the fastest i could go was 50 mph. Was told it was the fuel pump.
Fuel pump is replaced, along with tranny fluid and oil. Also was told I had a cracked fuel line.
Soon after leaving OK, with new FP, truck runs warmer than normal, hovering between 200 and 240. But not in the red, still in white. So I continue to drive to the nearest town, where I was going to check fluids, but suddenly I smelled burning coolant, and the truck temp shot up to the white line above red, i pulled over, truck shut off and I coasted off the road. Smoke was coming from below the spark plugs, valve covers?
The lower rad hose had a huge hole in the side, and whole side of truck of wet.
Bought a new hose, but when i restarted it, it ran like it was misfiring, kept dying, and was still over heating.
So here we are.
Thank you everyone for your input. Wish I went to mechanic school, rather than horses, haha.
I'm not mechanically inclined, I train horses. But I am aware of any new noises or vibrations the truck makes, and so when things break I fix what I'm told whats broken, hence the fuel pump. It whined so loud you could hear it inside the truck. Took it to the garage, and was told I was being a silly blonde, and its old and whines.
So I get to OK from PA, and truck has no horsepower, shudders badly when driven, and sounds like the tranny cant decide a gear. It also slowed down to the point where the fastest i could go was 50 mph. Was told it was the fuel pump.
Fuel pump is replaced, along with tranny fluid and oil. Also was told I had a cracked fuel line.
Soon after leaving OK, with new FP, truck runs warmer than normal, hovering between 200 and 240. But not in the red, still in white. So I continue to drive to the nearest town, where I was going to check fluids, but suddenly I smelled burning coolant, and the truck temp shot up to the white line above red, i pulled over, truck shut off and I coasted off the road. Smoke was coming from below the spark plugs, valve covers?
The lower rad hose had a huge hole in the side, and whole side of truck of wet.
Bought a new hose, but when i restarted it, it ran like it was misfiring, kept dying, and was still over heating.
So here we are.
Thank you everyone for your input. Wish I went to mechanic school, rather than horses, haha.
Banned
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 967
Likes: 0
From: MI USA
My bad, I was looking for a screen name of "Jen the Daughter".
Hiya Jen, glad you made it Ok and hope the damages aren't too bad on the truck.
I get attached to all of my vehicles, and don't give up on them unless I am forced to.
Hiya Jen, glad you made it Ok and hope the damages aren't too bad on the truck.
I get attached to all of my vehicles, and don't give up on them unless I am forced to.
Legend
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 7,843
Likes: 13
From: DFW, Texas
It really does sound like a popped head gasket, but with the temp pegging and the the coolant lost, I'd wager the heads are cracked as well. The stock heads can crack on a perfectly fine running engine, unfortunately.
At 200,000 miles, I would suggest a new engine. The piston rings could be going from normal wear and tear at any rate, and I'd hate to see you have the whole top end replaced and then turn around and have another set back in 10,000 miles.
If you do choose to have the engine rebuilt, try ordering the parts and only paying for labor.
www.rockauto.com
You can order an entire top end gasket set: FEL-PRO Part # HS26179PT1 for $90, a set of head bolts, exhaust manifold studs, and you can do an entire top end tear down and reassembly. I'd throw in a new T-stat for 10 bucks as a precaution since it overheated.
if somebody can get you a discount code, you can get another 5% off an insanely low price already. I don't know if this one is still active:
Your discount code is:
27542051058793
Using Your Discount Code
Enter the code above in the "How did you hear about us" line of the shopping cart. If you are using our traditional HTML catalog, please click the "Apply" button to the right of the field. Your discount will automatically appear, subtracted from your order total.
__________________________________________________ ______________________
If you do have to buy new heads, go to clearwater cylinder heads: www.cylinder-heads.com
The EQ heads can be found for $375 a head and are far better quality for barely any more money, and they come fully assembled with springs, locks, and retainers, you just have to swap the rockers, pushrods, and valve covers back on. I've also seen them advertise on Ebay for almost $50 off each head from even their own website. The seller name on ebay is: headsbycch. They also sell remans. Ask for Bob the owner when you call.
At 200,000 miles, I would suggest a new engine. The piston rings could be going from normal wear and tear at any rate, and I'd hate to see you have the whole top end replaced and then turn around and have another set back in 10,000 miles.
If you do choose to have the engine rebuilt, try ordering the parts and only paying for labor.
www.rockauto.com
You can order an entire top end gasket set: FEL-PRO Part # HS26179PT1 for $90, a set of head bolts, exhaust manifold studs, and you can do an entire top end tear down and reassembly. I'd throw in a new T-stat for 10 bucks as a precaution since it overheated.
if somebody can get you a discount code, you can get another 5% off an insanely low price already. I don't know if this one is still active:
Your discount code is:
27542051058793
Using Your Discount Code
Enter the code above in the "How did you hear about us" line of the shopping cart. If you are using our traditional HTML catalog, please click the "Apply" button to the right of the field. Your discount will automatically appear, subtracted from your order total.
__________________________________________________ ______________________
If you do have to buy new heads, go to clearwater cylinder heads: www.cylinder-heads.com
The EQ heads can be found for $375 a head and are far better quality for barely any more money, and they come fully assembled with springs, locks, and retainers, you just have to swap the rockers, pushrods, and valve covers back on. I've also seen them advertise on Ebay for almost $50 off each head from even their own website. The seller name on ebay is: headsbycch. They also sell remans. Ask for Bob the owner when you call.
Record Breaker
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,222
Likes: 4
From: NB, Canada
I bet I get more attached to my vehicles than you......still got every one I've owned since I was 18 lol..... sittin in an old field down near my dad's house
about 10 cars there, counting 2 stock cars
Banned
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 967
Likes: 0
From: MI USA
Well hey, if I had an old field available, I'd still have all of mine, or most anyhow.
If a vehicle sits in the same place for 3 days around here it'll get a sticker to move it or get towed within 48 hours.
If a vehicle sits in the same place for 3 days around here it'll get a sticker to move it or get towed within 48 hours.