type of injectors??
Administrator
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 87,399
Likes: 4,214
From: Clayton MI
That just show right there you have no experience with injectors.
Your best friend http://www.google.com/ read some more.
Your best friend http://www.google.com/ read some more.
Champion
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 2,697
Likes: 3
From: Cape Carteret NC
Ck knows his business.. he provided data, links, and expounded on his experience for no other reason but to share.. he didn't offer despairing comments because it made him feel better, nor troll a forum spreading questionable information as if its factual..
I don't have the p/n because I didn't memorize it, and I'm not in front of my computer, I'm on the phone.. I do, however, remember what I bought..
Siemens is far and above the best maker of injectors.. incidentally, they are the makers of our stock injectors.. Bosch do make ford motor sport gen iii 4 holes.. true.. pretty much the thing to be aware of when dealing with FMS injectors is the flow is rated at 39psi.. any FMS is rated at 39, but an injector made by Bosch but not for FMS may or may not be.
I don't have the p/n because I didn't memorize it, and I'm not in front of my computer, I'm on the phone.. I do, however, remember what I bought..
Siemens is far and above the best maker of injectors.. incidentally, they are the makers of our stock injectors.. Bosch do make ford motor sport gen iii 4 holes.. true.. pretty much the thing to be aware of when dealing with FMS injectors is the flow is rated at 39psi.. any FMS is rated at 39, but an injector made by Bosch but not for FMS may or may not be.
Banned
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 93
Likes: 1
What have you done to your ram? Any install threads or pictures of said mod/repair? Didnt think so.
Banned
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 93
Likes: 1
Ck knows his business.. he provided data, links, and expounded on his experience for no other reason but to share.. he didn't offer despairing comments because it made him feel better, nor troll a forum spreading questionable information as if its factual..
I don't have the p/n because I didn't memorize it, and I'm not in front of my computer, I'm on the phone.. I do, however, remember what I bought..
Siemens is far and above the best maker of injectors.. incidentally, they are the makers of our stock injectors.. Bosch do make ford motor sport gen iii 4 holes.. true.. pretty much the thing to be aware of when dealing with FMS injectors is the flow is rated at 39psi.. any FMS is rated at 39, but an injector made by Bosch but not for FMS may or may not be.
I don't have the p/n because I didn't memorize it, and I'm not in front of my computer, I'm on the phone.. I do, however, remember what I bought..
Siemens is far and above the best maker of injectors.. incidentally, they are the makers of our stock injectors.. Bosch do make ford motor sport gen iii 4 holes.. true.. pretty much the thing to be aware of when dealing with FMS injectors is the flow is rated at 39psi.. any FMS is rated at 39, but an injector made by Bosch but not for FMS may or may not be.
Hasnt changed even a ex mod has this in his sig...If you say you put in a part you should have the details including but not limited to the part number. Open the hood and look at the number then transfer it to paper with pencil.
Originally Posted by CharlieEscobar
Like Hydra said, give some details- this forum is amazing.
Last edited by 4085spd; Nov 27, 2011 at 11:36 PM.
Administrator
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 87,399
Likes: 4,214
From: Clayton MI
I don't need to provide my resume for you. I state information that I have either gotten from reading, (reliable sources...) or direct experience, when I am wrong, I will freely admit it. I have nothing to prove to you, nor do I feel any inclination to do so. You are disparaging members here on a fairly regular basis, with unsubstantiated supposition. If you want to stay here, I highly recommend you alter your posting style to something a bit less adversarial.
Banned
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 93
Likes: 1
Oh, well, you know, the dodge is the only vehicle I have ever owned. And of course the only vehicle I have ever worked on........
I don't need to provide my resume for you. I state information that I have either gotten from reading, (reliable sources...) or direct experience, when I am wrong, I will freely admit it. I have nothing to prove to you, nor do I feel any inclination to do so. You are disparaging members here on a fairly regular basis, with unsubstantiated supposition. If you want to stay here, I highly recommend you alter your posting style to something a bit less adversarial.
I don't need to provide my resume for you. I state information that I have either gotten from reading, (reliable sources...) or direct experience, when I am wrong, I will freely admit it. I have nothing to prove to you, nor do I feel any inclination to do so. You are disparaging members here on a fairly regular basis, with unsubstantiated supposition. If you want to stay here, I highly recommend you alter your posting style to something a bit less adversarial.
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 57
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From: on mother earth
Like asking your podiatrist for advice about your abdullah oblongata or a dentist about your vision or in motor vehicle terms asking a tire shop to rebuild your transmission.
They all may know alittle but have never done it and are in no way qualified to give advice.
They all may know alittle but have never done it and are in no way qualified to give advice.
All Star
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 787
Likes: 1
From: bellingham wa
What ever if you want to bannnnn me for disagreeing then go for it. BUT THE QUESTION STILL STANDS WHAT HAVE YOU DONE TO YOUR RAM. ANY THREADS POSTS PICTURES DETAILS ANYTHING? NOTHING AT ALL SO HOW COULD ANYONE TAKE ADVISE FROM SOMEONE WITH NO EXPERIENCE WORKING ON THERE RAM IS BEYOUND ME.
i have talked to him about problems I've had with my ram and he has done a great job.. this is a place for people who own dodges to come and ask questions, learn, and repair there trucks, we are like family and if you have a problem with one of us you have a problem with everyone.. HEYYOU was just giving input to the posting...the reason we have post is for peoples input. and you seem to have a very large mouth on you. which i understand when your on the internet you can be a big bad dude... but if thats how you want to act and treat people on here trying to help you like ****.. then we dont need or want the type here..
I'm still growing up(i'm only 20) but one thing i have learned if you treat your elders with respect and you seem to have a lack of respect.. idk if it cause your parents were druggies or your just a problem-ed person. but no matter your past please be respectful and and if thats to much to ask.. then please leave the fourms
Banned
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 57
Likes: 0
From: on mother earth
i have talked to him about problems I've had with my ram and he has done a great job.. this is a place for people who own dodges to come and ask questions, learn, and repair there trucks, we are like family and if you have a problem with one of us you have a problem with everyone.. HEYYOU was just giving input to the posting...the reason we have post is for peoples input. and you seem to have a very large mouth on you. which i understand when your on the internet you can be a big bad dude... but if thats how you want to act and treat people on here trying to help you like ****.. then we dont need or want the type here..
I'm still growing up(i'm only 20) but one thing i have learned if you treat your elders with respect and you seem to have a lack of respect.. idk if it cause your parents were druggies or your just a problem-ed person. but no matter your past please be respectful and and if thats to much to ask.. then please leave the fourms
I'm still growing up(i'm only 20) but one thing i have learned if you treat your elders with respect and you seem to have a lack of respect.. idk if it cause your parents were druggies or your just a problem-ed person. but no matter your past please be respectful and and if thats to much to ask.. then please leave the fourms
Last edited by Mpi360; Nov 28, 2011 at 04:28 AM.
Champion
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 2,697
Likes: 3
From: Cape Carteret NC
jeez.. all this drama, for what? so one person can assert their internet baddassery based on knowledge and the ability to insult?
whatever...
there are some folks here who are really smart when it comes to these trucks in general.. there are some who are smart about fuel systems, some who are smart about ignition, some with transmissions and gears, dang near every part of the truck is covered with the crew..
some people show up only after their wife has kicked the crap out of them, or their mom has sent them to their room for the eve, and they profess to have greater insight than anyone or everything.. maybe they do have some good information to share, but then they go about it in a nasty way..
I don't know about you fellas, but I would love to see pics of a 408 5 speed, details on the build, youtube clips of it in action, ect.. For someone who speaks ill of others gleaning information from the web, there certainly are a lot of references to youtube (the oracle of all oracles where everything is true)..
any dang way.....
on the subject of injectors-
be mindful which ones you select.. read the fine print, and do your own math using the test data they present.. OR, read this and other forums enough to know who is using them, and if those 'who's' are credible enough to follow.. ignore the blowhards..
Fuel Injector: Bosch XF2E-C4B is the p/n.. found here
what Bruce at FiveO fails to tell you (because he likely doesn't know, he just looks at the spec sheet) is that these are rated 22# at 39psi.. Our trucks run 49psi.. there is considerably more fuel per hour being delivered than 22#.. that is fine, we need more than 22#- we need 23.5#'s to be precise.. but at 49psi, those injectors are pumping near 25.5~26#.. they have to be curved..
HemiFever did the math for me, and cut back the duty cycle hard scripted in the tables 6%, and nailed it.. He used information he had on hand from previous adjustments for other users, and he did the math based on specs OF THAT PARTICULAR INJECTOR.. meaning, another injector rated at 22#/39psi may or may not have followed the same ramp when introducing increased pressure..
After installing the injectors, installing a wideband a/f, and running the engine through various RPM ranges unloaded (sitting still) and loaded (hauling down the highway), I got a solid reading.. The PCM can curve fuel all on it's own to a pretty decent degree, but the parameter it can curve is not that wide- so, you gotta be close to begin with.. When under WOT conditions, the PCM opens loop and runs off of tables, and basically says to the injectors (in your best Scottish accent) "Give her all she's got, captain!".. you run a risk of washing the cylinders- running excessively rich, which kills power, or you run the risk of running lean and burning holes in your pistons (or other things just as nasty).. So, you better be close with your tune, and have your numbers right..
the stock injectors are fine.. they're actually really good quality injectors.. they can handle anything you do to your engine short of boost or increasing displacement.. If it were me, and it isn't, but if it were and I had it to do all over again, I would NOT change injectors..
cost of injectors: ~$300ish
cost of wideband a/f gauge: ~$250
cost of custom tune: ~$100 (plus the canned and programmer)
total $650
cost of cam: ~$300ish
cost of gaskets, lifters, lifter rods, valve springs, ect: ~$300ish
cost of custom tune: $100
total $700
which gives you more? guess.. which increases in a quantifiable way both power and economy? Which makes more sense, now?
Injectors are just about the last thing to be screwed with on a basically stock engine, or even an engine with minor internal work and major bolt-ons.. they are popular ALMOST in the sense those eBay IAT's are.. foolsgold, in other words..
I would love to tell you my money was well spent, and that I LOVE my injectors and would part with the $$$ again for them, but that would be a lie, and that would not be very fair in the spirit of this forum.. you see, some people will spout their supposed demigod status of knowledge, and some will tell you of what they've read.. some will simply say "I did it, and it was/wasn't worth it".. I did it.. It wasn't worth it.. That hurts my pride a little, but being able to share my mistake and tell you not to do it 'unless', helps me recover some of that..
peace..
whatever...
there are some folks here who are really smart when it comes to these trucks in general.. there are some who are smart about fuel systems, some who are smart about ignition, some with transmissions and gears, dang near every part of the truck is covered with the crew..
some people show up only after their wife has kicked the crap out of them, or their mom has sent them to their room for the eve, and they profess to have greater insight than anyone or everything.. maybe they do have some good information to share, but then they go about it in a nasty way..
I don't know about you fellas, but I would love to see pics of a 408 5 speed, details on the build, youtube clips of it in action, ect.. For someone who speaks ill of others gleaning information from the web, there certainly are a lot of references to youtube (the oracle of all oracles where everything is true)..
any dang way.....
on the subject of injectors-
be mindful which ones you select.. read the fine print, and do your own math using the test data they present.. OR, read this and other forums enough to know who is using them, and if those 'who's' are credible enough to follow.. ignore the blowhards..
Fuel Injector: Bosch XF2E-C4B is the p/n.. found here
what Bruce at FiveO fails to tell you (because he likely doesn't know, he just looks at the spec sheet) is that these are rated 22# at 39psi.. Our trucks run 49psi.. there is considerably more fuel per hour being delivered than 22#.. that is fine, we need more than 22#- we need 23.5#'s to be precise.. but at 49psi, those injectors are pumping near 25.5~26#.. they have to be curved..
HemiFever did the math for me, and cut back the duty cycle hard scripted in the tables 6%, and nailed it.. He used information he had on hand from previous adjustments for other users, and he did the math based on specs OF THAT PARTICULAR INJECTOR.. meaning, another injector rated at 22#/39psi may or may not have followed the same ramp when introducing increased pressure..
After installing the injectors, installing a wideband a/f, and running the engine through various RPM ranges unloaded (sitting still) and loaded (hauling down the highway), I got a solid reading.. The PCM can curve fuel all on it's own to a pretty decent degree, but the parameter it can curve is not that wide- so, you gotta be close to begin with.. When under WOT conditions, the PCM opens loop and runs off of tables, and basically says to the injectors (in your best Scottish accent) "Give her all she's got, captain!".. you run a risk of washing the cylinders- running excessively rich, which kills power, or you run the risk of running lean and burning holes in your pistons (or other things just as nasty).. So, you better be close with your tune, and have your numbers right..
the stock injectors are fine.. they're actually really good quality injectors.. they can handle anything you do to your engine short of boost or increasing displacement.. If it were me, and it isn't, but if it were and I had it to do all over again, I would NOT change injectors..
cost of injectors: ~$300ish
cost of wideband a/f gauge: ~$250
cost of custom tune: ~$100 (plus the canned and programmer)
total $650
cost of cam: ~$300ish
cost of gaskets, lifters, lifter rods, valve springs, ect: ~$300ish
cost of custom tune: $100
total $700
which gives you more? guess.. which increases in a quantifiable way both power and economy? Which makes more sense, now?
Injectors are just about the last thing to be screwed with on a basically stock engine, or even an engine with minor internal work and major bolt-ons.. they are popular ALMOST in the sense those eBay IAT's are.. foolsgold, in other words..
I would love to tell you my money was well spent, and that I LOVE my injectors and would part with the $$$ again for them, but that would be a lie, and that would not be very fair in the spirit of this forum.. you see, some people will spout their supposed demigod status of knowledge, and some will tell you of what they've read.. some will simply say "I did it, and it was/wasn't worth it".. I did it.. It wasn't worth it.. That hurts my pride a little, but being able to share my mistake and tell you not to do it 'unless', helps me recover some of that..
peace..