These are the upgrades....please answer.
Grand Champion
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 6,041
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From: Gilbert, Arizona
Don't this your money away on the log style headers. You won't feel them or hear them. May as well just keep the stockers if that's the case. We've been repeating the same information on all your threads so far.
Logs are bad
Shorties/mids are better
long is best (for most that can run them)
Logs are bad
Shorties/mids are better
long is best (for most that can run them)
Thread Starter
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Professional
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 113
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From: TAMPA, FL
I know you have been repeating truckin, lol. I guess I just cant find shorties that are stainless and ceramic coated that dont cost a house payment..lol. I think however tonight I am gonna buy the lowering kit.
Grand Champion
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 6,041
Likes: 0
From: Gilbert, Arizona
Really?
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
Go fast mods are not cheap. Which is why in one of your threads I mentioned to plan it out. Plan out the supporting mods you want and dont rush them. Save for what you want.
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
Go fast mods are not cheap. Which is why in one of your threads I mentioned to plan it out. Plan out the supporting mods you want and dont rush them. Save for what you want.
Grand Champion
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 6,041
Likes: 0
From: Gilbert, Arizona
Yes, I believe you have the idea. The change from 3" to 2-1/2" at the collector on the headers will be short. The cats will be as close to the header as possible, then they will have 2-1/2" pipe from each of them to the MF (no pun intended 
) y-pipe, then a single 3" from there to wherever the muffler will be, then out the back of the truck. I personally like to not see the exhaust at all, only hear it. That's why I'll have mine tucked up high and dumped at the rear bumper; cut even with the bottom of the bumper. The only thing about the exhaust that will be seen is the humid exhaust blowing out from it on cold days until the engine warms up.
) y-pipe, then a single 3" from there to wherever the muffler will be, then out the back of the truck. I personally like to not see the exhaust at all, only hear it. That's why I'll have mine tucked up high and dumped at the rear bumper; cut even with the bottom of the bumper. The only thing about the exhaust that will be seen is the humid exhaust blowing out from it on cold days until the engine warms up.The stock cats on my truck are 2-1/2" in/out or close enough that they will fit nicely with that size pipe. The Pacesetter LT's come with a 3" collector, so it would have to be reduced to 2-1/2" to easily weld the cats on.
I don't know about stainless steel, but my Spintech muffler (3441XL) is made of really solid-feeling metal and sounds really good. It has a similar sound as the mufflers I used to hear so often on Mustangs. It doesn't really drone except for maybe just a little bit around 2,000 rpm, but nothing too bad at all. It has a nice performance sound and a bass tone to it at idle and slightly above that will set off car alarms.
I don't know about stainless steel, but my Spintech muffler (3441XL) is made of really solid-feeling metal and sounds really good. It has a similar sound as the mufflers I used to hear so often on Mustangs. It doesn't really drone except for maybe just a little bit around 2,000 rpm, but nothing too bad at all. It has a nice performance sound and a bass tone to it at idle and slightly above that will set off car alarms.
Also the cats are not bolted on, they are welded on on bolth sides. they are bolted on further up the system. So you are already cutting them off to make them fit. May as well up the pipe diameter at the same time.
Captain
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 554
Likes: 0
From: Plant City, FL
I want to get the best performance for how I drive my truck. If I open everything to 3" then I'm concerned that low end will suffer. I would actually prefer the headers to have a 2-1/2" collector on them like the Hedmans do, but those cost another $100+ for a set of them just to get the 2-1/2" collector.
The cats would be welded in as 2-1/2" in/out. Both 2-1/2" pipes after them would combine into a single 3". I want the velocity to be maintained through the cats to the y-pipe, so I believe the smaller diameter from the headers through the cats to where they combine would be a good idea. Maintaining exhaust velocity is also why I will be using the y-pipe and single exhaust from there back. I want more off-the-line torque than top-end power. I occasionally tow an enclosed trailer as well, so maintaining low-end torque is important to me.
The cats would be welded in as 2-1/2" in/out. Both 2-1/2" pipes after them would combine into a single 3". I want the velocity to be maintained through the cats to the y-pipe, so I believe the smaller diameter from the headers through the cats to where they combine would be a good idea. Maintaining exhaust velocity is also why I will be using the y-pipe and single exhaust from there back. I want more off-the-line torque than top-end power. I occasionally tow an enclosed trailer as well, so maintaining low-end torque is important to me.
Administrator
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,686
Likes: 21
From: South Georgia/East Florida
Low end will suffer a little bit. The funny thing is over-all your peak torque will increase, but it the torque curve will move farther up the RPM range.
I originally omitted my cats, now I don't think the Ram cats are very restrictive but like you, I went 3" from the collectors back to the "Y" I had made which were two 3" in and whatever the inlet to the Blowmaster 50HD I had at the time was - I'm thinking 2 1/2". Now the shop that made my "Y" scrunched the piping a little, but it's still a lot better flowing than the factory "Y" (I have a Maggy Y in the garage, just waiting to have to do something else under there before I install it). I'm thinking the low end torque loss was more a result of being 3" from the headers all the way back to about 3' from the rear bumper where my "Y" is and not so much omitting the cats.
When I thought I was done, right down to non-foulers which worked perfectly, I wasn't happy with the low end but instead of climbing my fat a$$ (I was about 50 lbs. heavier then) I ended up taking the truck to the shop that made my "Y" and let them cut and weld the cats back in, then all I had to do was extend the O2 sensor wires. It didn't even take the guy an hour to cut and weld my cats back in (it's nice to be able to stand up and work under a vehicle, LOL) and they only charged me $75 for labor and the two reducers they needed. Now had I done this up at the farm in Georgia, I would have done this myself, I have a hunting buddy whose step-dad owns a tire and auto repair center I could have used their lift during closed hours - it's actually where he and I installed my suspension lift kit.
Most (not all) of the low end came back, now this was POST lift but PRE 4.56 gears. With 4.56s low end really isn't a problem because I'm roughly 400 rpm or so higher at any given speed now.
My suggestion, keep the cats and if it's necked down SLIGHTLY to go into/out of the cats, no biggie unless we are talking a "track truck" here. I'm at 3" out to where they cut in the cats and used a reducer and then 3" again after the reducer on the other side of the cats until the single out of the "Y" where I'm 2.5" and stays that right to my tips.
I'll get under the truck and double check my "long winded story" for actual dimensions, it's been since early summer of '05 when I did this and I have trouble remembering what I had for supper last night...
I originally omitted my cats, now I don't think the Ram cats are very restrictive but like you, I went 3" from the collectors back to the "Y" I had made which were two 3" in and whatever the inlet to the Blowmaster 50HD I had at the time was - I'm thinking 2 1/2". Now the shop that made my "Y" scrunched the piping a little, but it's still a lot better flowing than the factory "Y" (I have a Maggy Y in the garage, just waiting to have to do something else under there before I install it). I'm thinking the low end torque loss was more a result of being 3" from the headers all the way back to about 3' from the rear bumper where my "Y" is and not so much omitting the cats.
When I thought I was done, right down to non-foulers which worked perfectly, I wasn't happy with the low end but instead of climbing my fat a$$ (I was about 50 lbs. heavier then) I ended up taking the truck to the shop that made my "Y" and let them cut and weld the cats back in, then all I had to do was extend the O2 sensor wires. It didn't even take the guy an hour to cut and weld my cats back in (it's nice to be able to stand up and work under a vehicle, LOL) and they only charged me $75 for labor and the two reducers they needed. Now had I done this up at the farm in Georgia, I would have done this myself, I have a hunting buddy whose step-dad owns a tire and auto repair center I could have used their lift during closed hours - it's actually where he and I installed my suspension lift kit.
Most (not all) of the low end came back, now this was POST lift but PRE 4.56 gears. With 4.56s low end really isn't a problem because I'm roughly 400 rpm or so higher at any given speed now.
My suggestion, keep the cats and if it's necked down SLIGHTLY to go into/out of the cats, no biggie unless we are talking a "track truck" here. I'm at 3" out to where they cut in the cats and used a reducer and then 3" again after the reducer on the other side of the cats until the single out of the "Y" where I'm 2.5" and stays that right to my tips.
I'll get under the truck and double check my "long winded story" for actual dimensions, it's been since early summer of '05 when I did this and I have trouble remembering what I had for supper last night...
Last edited by HammerZ71; Feb 22, 2012 at 01:22 PM.
Thread Starter
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Professional
Joined: May 2011
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From: TAMPA, FL
I enjoyed all of your story, lol. And this reply goes out to each one individual..
Trkn151 - Wow I thought I truly looked everywhere, but not ONCE did I ever come across that website. Most of the websites were autopartswarehouse, autoanything, streetside etc.. So thank you for those links. I do Like the gibsons, and of the models theer is only $375 although I don tknow if that model was stainless, wait are all those stainless with coating that you linked ?
Ron & Hammer - I have decided that I want to try and NOT wled if possible, its more of a money thing. And as you sai din your story hammer this is not a track truck,lol. I just want a good header that is a shorty which trkns151 links seem to point me towards. And who knows I might get sucked into those gibson logs if they are LOW enough in price, and I mean LOW. I called Gibson and they did say that they did show a good bit more in the low end with the log but not so much mid or hi.
you guys are awesome thanks for sticking around.
Trkn151 - Wow I thought I truly looked everywhere, but not ONCE did I ever come across that website. Most of the websites were autopartswarehouse, autoanything, streetside etc.. So thank you for those links. I do Like the gibsons, and of the models theer is only $375 although I don tknow if that model was stainless, wait are all those stainless with coating that you linked ?
Ron & Hammer - I have decided that I want to try and NOT wled if possible, its more of a money thing. And as you sai din your story hammer this is not a track truck,lol. I just want a good header that is a shorty which trkns151 links seem to point me towards. And who knows I might get sucked into those gibson logs if they are LOW enough in price, and I mean LOW. I called Gibson and they did say that they did show a good bit more in the low end with the log but not so much mid or hi.
you guys are awesome thanks for sticking around.
Grand Champion
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 6,041
Likes: 0
From: Gilbert, Arizona
Those are all coated.
The only time I lost lowend grunt was while.I was running with no cats. It drugass off the line. Put the cats in and it was a 180, lowend was back and my mid and top range was still strong. I can see using the 2.5" piping on a dual setup, but a Y pipe and lt's I say let keep the cats and let it breath.
The only time I lost lowend grunt was while.I was running with no cats. It drugass off the line. Put the cats in and it was a 180, lowend was back and my mid and top range was still strong. I can see using the 2.5" piping on a dual setup, but a Y pipe and lt's I say let keep the cats and let it breath.
Grand Champion
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 6,041
Likes: 0
From: Gilbert, Arizona
Unless those logs are under $100 I wouldn't even look at them, your truck is a reg cab short bed, you want tq but you don't need as much as the quad cabs need. Rcsb's shine in the mid to top
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Professional
Joined: May 2011
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From: TAMPA, FL
Trkn151 -
http://store.mvpautoparts.com/gibson...ic-coated.html These say they are only for 2003 models. Yet here it says different sighs (Its reads 05-80) Someone needs to get the story straight, lol. http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
And alot of those truckin are steel and coated but not STAINLESS. I def want stainless if I am getting caoted because that will make all the difference. And BBK brand pisses me off because I talked to there techs and "ALL" there current headers are made from aluminized steel and not stainless which is ignorant I think. Until I can find a $500 stainless ceramic header besides the Gibson i guess I have to hold off on the headers, which sucks. So I guess now I need to worry about the Y pipe. What are the suggestions in the room for the what inlet size should be ? Since I know the outlet size needs to be 3" ?
http://store.mvpautoparts.com/gibson...ic-coated.html These say they are only for 2003 models. Yet here it says different sighs (Its reads 05-80) Someone needs to get the story straight, lol. http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/inde...036607cd397705
And alot of those truckin are steel and coated but not STAINLESS. I def want stainless if I am getting caoted because that will make all the difference. And BBK brand pisses me off because I talked to there techs and "ALL" there current headers are made from aluminized steel and not stainless which is ignorant I think. Until I can find a $500 stainless ceramic header besides the Gibson i guess I have to hold off on the headers, which sucks. So I guess now I need to worry about the Y pipe. What are the suggestions in the room for the what inlet size should be ? Since I know the outlet size needs to be 3" ?