Well, finally got around to pulling my injectors... ugly is an understatement!!! Number 2 and 5 had a poor return. I was experiencing poor performance, lack of power, poor mileage and higher EGTs. Number 1 looked good (nozzle wise) but then the tube was plugged not completely though. The rest looked like they were battered with beer batter then deep fried!!! They had so much carbon on them, I'm surprised I didn't blow something apart!! Originally I thought with the rough idle and surging, it was the FCA which I replaced earlier, helped some but was short lived. The truck never idles for any lenght of time, she alsogets regular work outs hauling the 10k# TT and towing equipement trailer with the ole John Deere tractor. So after researching and consulting many diesel gurus, I've concluded that the so called diesel fuel treatments combined with the programmerwere the cause! I have parts spread out in the shop and waiting on injector rebuild.While waiting I've done a valve lash and installed a GDP 2 micron filter kit between OEM filter housing and the CP3 pump. Also installed low pressure fuel gauge.

I agree with Mopar1973man, fuel conditioners are out and I'll being using 2cycle oil instead. As for prgrammers they just add too much pressure for stock injectors. Simply replacing the nozzles for largers ones still leaves the OEM bodies which are the weak point, when it comes to extra fuel pressure!

I did visit the local stealer (I still have warranty left...for all the good it is!!!) was told that due to my AFE intake and blade runner, no cat and areo muffler and the boost, EGT and tranny temp guages my warranty is void!! So they wannted $7000.00 to do my injectors!! When will DC see the light!? GM is going out of their way to replace failed injectors on theirduracraps with very little to no hassles! When I owned my Ferd and I broke something while out in the bush working I could get replacement parts sent to me to replace under warranty! I lost a tie-rod on my Dodge on a dirt road 200miles from the nearest dealer and had the part shipped to me which I replaced myself on my coin. When I returned home with broken part and receipt for the newtie-rod, they denied me warranty as I was not a " DC trained technician"!!! But, I still love my truck and would never think of getting rid of it, even with bad injectors I was still able to out work any ferd or duracrap!!!

PS. I dropped me camera, its in more pieces then my truck!!!!So no pics ...sorry Mayfair [sm=boohoo.gif]



All-righty then.... last part was my venting....

[sm=happybounce.gif]

 

How many miles are on those injectors?

 

roughly 68k miles.

 

What kind of Fuel treatments were you using?

 

What do you mean by having the injectors "rebuilt?" Why not just replace them with Edge injectors or something?

That sucks that the dealer won't work woth you, that really effing blows, although ( and I hate to say it ) but if it was additives that caused the problem, do you still think it is Dodges fault?

Not trying to upset you, just asking a question brotha ...

 

Rebuilding the injectors was the cheapest and quickest turnaround, downtime for me costs (work truck). Not really into big powerat this time(higher hp sticks still use the bosch body, which really can't handle the extra pressure!). As for DC, well I didn't expect them to replace them under warranty, thats a gimmie. Although the dealer I purchased my truck at, sells and installs various so-called power enhancements, they aslo push their brand of fuel conditioner. I had been fighting with them and other dealers over the injector issue for a year, it gets very tiringeach time to have so called trained techs concludingthat they are unable to" duplicate problems or conditions...".DCs fault? I dunno, bosch says 5 to 7 micron filtering, DC installs/sells 10 micron filters (if you show upat a dealer with non OEM filter say something in the 2 to 5 micron, they will and can deny warranty). Its akin to ford and navistar, navistar told ford the engine they wanted wasn't meant for light duty trucks, ford didn't listen and proceded with that engine and added their crap to it as they saw fit, then wonder why navistar is fighting ford! We all know that if we advance the timing on these trucks we can get better power and mileage, and with a cleaner burning engine! I guess what really needs to happen, is Bosch needs to sit down and really rethink thier injectors and pumps! With the new altra low sulphur diesel we are goig to see alot more failures!

I was using Power Service white bottle, we don't get the grey bottled stuff up here. I pulled the original FCA apart just for shiets and giggles, I found it was gummed up. I was mxing some of that MMO with thePSD, maybe that may have caused some of the gumming.As for the injectors we found somewere almost plugged,all of them were heavily carboned up.I got real lucky, none of the pistons or cylinders were damaged! (used borescope and checked each cylinder).

Upset? Hardly, it could have been a lot worse!! I could have had DC replace the injectors at a cost of $7000 to $8000.00!! But at $100.00 each to rebuild and same day turnaround, what would you do? I got them back about 10am today, truck is running great!! tomorrow I will install the GDP 2 micron filter, fuel pressure gauge and reinstall Amsoil oil bypass filtert, original filter plate had a defect which caused oil filter to leak.

These are just myopinionsand findings through research and just plain old asking those that are experienced, agree or not, will not upset me. Too many of these forumshave people in them have complaining about one thing or another (ford,gm and dodge), be it poor experiences with service departments or even aftermarket industries. Go to the Diablo Sport site and see all the belly aching going on there! Even Mads smarty has its issues! History is showinga large number of injector failures more so with 3rd gen, be it from programmers/pressure boxes to fuel additives. As for trannys, this is my conclusion when one (and I am guilty as charged) installs a programmer or box or stacking, we're going to play and break something, eventually. My younger brother has 245k on his 05 3500 DRW with auto tranny hot shoting across north america. His truck is bare bones dose not use additives and has been trouble free, say for balljoints. There are plenty of stories like this, just wondering how manyof uscan say the same, that have programmers and/or pressure boxes or stacking?

 

Who rebuilt your injectors? Can you tell just by looking at them what kind of shape they are in? I'm wondering if they could be causing my bad mileage. My truck runs pretty good though.

 

When I pulled them, could tell right away. Numbers 2,3,4,5 and 6 were so carboned up, they looked like deep fried chicken legs!! Number 1 looked fairly clean. When I had shot them with my Raytech (infared temp gun) at first start up#1 was cold 0*C where as the rest were about 30-40*C after about 2 minutes of run time. After a long run time with the engine good and hot #1 still showed about 30-40* cooler! So it was obvious #1 was plugngged and not injecting fuel!

Don't know what to say about your poor mileage, other then the regular checks ie. filters, tire press., driving habits? Short of having injection system checked, low/high fuel press checks, return flow test these may give you an idea as to whether your system is up to snuff?

 

wow that is interesting info on your injectors... I have 90k on my truck and it still runs awesome (knock on wood)... the tst box I have does have a rail pressure mode to increase the peak pressure but from what I can tell, the only time it ever reaches it is when i'm on it pretty good. Did you ever run bio thru it?

 

I wish I hadn't dropped my camera, I had some great pcs to show how badly they carboned up!! I thought that the ole girl was cheatin on me by sneaking out to the local Mickey Ds, cloggin up her artories with some bio. But no such thing as bio up in these parts. According to bosch the CR can take up to 29,000psi,
I believe most prgrammers will max out at 26,000psi (common belief that, thats all the CR will take for extended periods) so most manufactures/programmers set their stuff at. Talking to a number of stick rebuilders the most common cause of injector failure is pressure. With most programmers having safety limits set, concerning pressure at 26k psi and Bosch saying the CR can take 29k psi, there shouldn't be as many failures due to the pressure!? Add some of these fuel conditioners with their solvents which maybe abrassive to the very "touchy" nature ofthe injectors, you increase the odds of failure. There is the case of diesel apprentices proving the importance, of having a very clean to the point sterile conditons in the "rebuildig shop". They had marked parts of the injector with a jiffy marker and found they couldn't get the parts to fit!! Injector rebuilding is like surgery, sterile andrubber gloves. The injector tubes have a "screen" in them which, in addition to engine harmonics, is used to "break up" particulites that make it past the filter system to help protect the injector. I seen a post but for the life of me I can't remember where I saw it. It showed what the top end looked like on a truck running heavyBio, it looked like the bottom of well used deep fryer!! There was stuff caked on everywhere! I read somewhere cummins recommends nothing more then B2 or B5, or void your warranty. That shows just how touchy these"new" injectors really are!

I never thought twice about this till I started having issues, like Nickbeek, I was having rough idle, engine loping, poor power and mileage, all this with no codes!!

So, it got me going, been pounding the keyboard searching everwhere for any info. There are so many opinions concerning this, but again how many trucks out there have 100,000, 200,000 miles on them running programmers/boxes and fuel conditioners, that have been trouble free.