1999 DRV 3500 5.9l stalling... TCC problem?
#1
11-24-2022, 08:43 PM
1999 DRV 3500 5.9l stalling... TCC problem?
Sorry for the wall of text, I just wanted to make sure I was thorough.
Hi guys,
Just bought my first Dodge in the form of a 1999 DRV 3500 5.9l with the intentions to turn it into a camper van. 75,000 miles and it used to be a church van with all of it's service done at one dealership. I love it so far, but have a few issues with it. I'll give you the timeline of my experience to this point:
- Bought van from a dealership, they had just gotten it in and didn't have a chance to take it through the shop (said price would probably increase after, assuming anything gets fixed). I figured I'd take a gamble, as I've been wrenching on cars for years... and know how to post on forums
They did warn me that, when the salesman took it for a test drive, it was stalling when he came up to a stop light. He just two-footed it until the light changed and took off again.
- I show up to buy it and bring my code scanner. Only code stored was for a TPS fault. Test drove it and couldn't replicate the issue. Bought the van, drove it home, and it didn't stall until I was backing into my driveway. Phew! I noticed that, when the throttle was let off suddenly, i.e. feathering it in reverse, that would freak the engine out and it would die. Very reasonable response to a bad TPS.
- I replaced the TPS the next day (first one from AutoZone fell apart in my hand... Second one stayed in tact). Also replaced the serp belt, tensioner, and idler pulley due to a significant squeal. Did an oil change too. Everything seemed fixed, so I took it for a test drive. The van did great, even when backing it into the driveway again.
- The next day, I decided I'd drive it to work to make sure it really was fixed, and I'm glad I did, because it was not. I was about 5 miles from home when I was approaching a stop light and the engine lugged for a second or two before finally dying. I decided to turn around and go back home to grab the daily instead. On the way, it did not get any better. At the next light, I tossed it in neutral to keep it alive. Once I put it back in drive when the light changed, it sounded like the transmission wasn't fully engaging (clicking noise, like the teeth of two gears barely meshing) and I had basically no power. Shut it off, put it back in neutral, started it, put it in drive, and drove off normally.
- At the next few lights, I would two-foot it as I approached and just kept the revs above idle until the light changed. That worked, but a few times it felt like, when I would stop, I would tap the gas while holding the brake, and something would "let go". The van would lurch pretty hard, then when I tapped the gas again, it wouldn't lurch nearly as violently and felt more like a normal car would if you tap the gas while holding the brake. To me, it felt like the torque converter lockup was not disengaging when I would come to a stop, but when I would feel it "let go", it unlocked. However it was hit or miss as to whether that "let go" would actually happen or if it would just keep dying.
I made it home and havent looked at the van yet. I know about the issues with the 46RE and it's TCC solenoid, but I'm not having the shudder or random disengagement issues everyone else seems to describe. Am I going down the wrong path with the torque converter? Could it be a TPS issue, since that's what I messed with most recently? Is there something else I should look into? There are no DTCs stored, so it's hard for me to really start somewhere, especially on a vehicle I'm not familiar with. Anybody have any insight into what it could be?
Hi guys,
Just bought my first Dodge in the form of a 1999 DRV 3500 5.9l with the intentions to turn it into a camper van. 75,000 miles and it used to be a church van with all of it's service done at one dealership. I love it so far, but have a few issues with it. I'll give you the timeline of my experience to this point:
- Bought van from a dealership, they had just gotten it in and didn't have a chance to take it through the shop (said price would probably increase after, assuming anything gets fixed). I figured I'd take a gamble, as I've been wrenching on cars for years... and know how to post on forums
They did warn me that, when the salesman took it for a test drive, it was stalling when he came up to a stop light. He just two-footed it until the light changed and took off again.
- I show up to buy it and bring my code scanner. Only code stored was for a TPS fault. Test drove it and couldn't replicate the issue. Bought the van, drove it home, and it didn't stall until I was backing into my driveway. Phew! I noticed that, when the throttle was let off suddenly, i.e. feathering it in reverse, that would freak the engine out and it would die. Very reasonable response to a bad TPS.
- I replaced the TPS the next day (first one from AutoZone fell apart in my hand... Second one stayed in tact). Also replaced the serp belt, tensioner, and idler pulley due to a significant squeal. Did an oil change too. Everything seemed fixed, so I took it for a test drive. The van did great, even when backing it into the driveway again.
- The next day, I decided I'd drive it to work to make sure it really was fixed, and I'm glad I did, because it was not. I was about 5 miles from home when I was approaching a stop light and the engine lugged for a second or two before finally dying. I decided to turn around and go back home to grab the daily instead. On the way, it did not get any better. At the next light, I tossed it in neutral to keep it alive. Once I put it back in drive when the light changed, it sounded like the transmission wasn't fully engaging (clicking noise, like the teeth of two gears barely meshing) and I had basically no power. Shut it off, put it back in neutral, started it, put it in drive, and drove off normally.
- At the next few lights, I would two-foot it as I approached and just kept the revs above idle until the light changed. That worked, but a few times it felt like, when I would stop, I would tap the gas while holding the brake, and something would "let go". The van would lurch pretty hard, then when I tapped the gas again, it wouldn't lurch nearly as violently and felt more like a normal car would if you tap the gas while holding the brake. To me, it felt like the torque converter lockup was not disengaging when I would come to a stop, but when I would feel it "let go", it unlocked. However it was hit or miss as to whether that "let go" would actually happen or if it would just keep dying.
I made it home and havent looked at the van yet. I know about the issues with the 46RE and it's TCC solenoid, but I'm not having the shudder or random disengagement issues everyone else seems to describe. Am I going down the wrong path with the torque converter? Could it be a TPS issue, since that's what I messed with most recently? Is there something else I should look into? There are no DTCs stored, so it's hard for me to really start somewhere, especially on a vehicle I'm not familiar with. Anybody have any insight into what it could be?
#3
11-25-2022, 07:58 AM
Couple things.... First, I would pull the throttle body, and clean it very thoroughly. The IAC well likes to get clogged up with carbon, and you get stalling at stops. Once you have it all back together, disconnect the battery, turn on the head lights, turn off headlights, reconnect battery. (resets PCM.) Then turn the key to "on", (not start) count to ten, (don't touch anything) THEN start the engine. This gives the PCM to learn the 'zero values' for the various sensors. It should figure out idle fairly quickly.
#4
11-25-2022, 09:11 AM
Couple things.... First, I would pull the throttle body, and clean it very thoroughly. The IAC well likes to get clogged up with carbon, and you get stalling at stops. Once you have it all back together, disconnect the battery, turn on the head lights, turn off headlights, reconnect battery. (resets PCM.) Then turn the key to "on", (not start) count to ten, (don't touch anything) THEN start the engine. This gives the PCM to learn the 'zero values' for the various sensors. It should figure out idle fairly quickly.
#5
11-26-2022, 07:49 PM
I'm back with an update:
I tried the above steps. It took an extra day because AutoZone didn't have the TB gasket and had to order it. The throttle body was surprisingly clean, but the gasket fell apart at the slightest touch, and the four TB bolts were only a hair past hand-tight. I pulled all the sensors, inspected and cleaned everything, reassembled with a new gasket, and now the problem has evolved.
The engine no longer dies at stops, but I am losing oil pressure. Initially, I just figured the oil pressure was dropping to 0 because the engine stalled, but now it seems to do it with no rhyme or reason. I'm not sure the range of the oil pressure sensors on these engines, but I start with good oil pressure, around 60-70, and when everything gets up to temp, the lowest I've seen is probably about 30, which seems pretty normal to me. However, when I'm sitting at a stop (only after about 5 miles of driving, I can't replicate it before that), the oil pressure gauge drops from 30 straight to 0. If I rev the engine a little, it shoots back up to 30, then in a second or two drops back to zero. Rinse and repeat, all of this while the engine is holding a strong idle (I wish these vans had tachs). Part of me thinks (hopes) it's a failing sensor or loose connection, but the other part of me thinks that the sensor only reads down to a value that the gauge reports as 30psi before dropping to 0.
Any thoughts/comments? I'll grab a new oil pressure sensor tomorrow, as they're in stock and only $30. Anything I should look for in the meantime?
I tried the above steps. It took an extra day because AutoZone didn't have the TB gasket and had to order it. The throttle body was surprisingly clean, but the gasket fell apart at the slightest touch, and the four TB bolts were only a hair past hand-tight. I pulled all the sensors, inspected and cleaned everything, reassembled with a new gasket, and now the problem has evolved.
The engine no longer dies at stops, but I am losing oil pressure. Initially, I just figured the oil pressure was dropping to 0 because the engine stalled, but now it seems to do it with no rhyme or reason. I'm not sure the range of the oil pressure sensors on these engines, but I start with good oil pressure, around 60-70, and when everything gets up to temp, the lowest I've seen is probably about 30, which seems pretty normal to me. However, when I'm sitting at a stop (only after about 5 miles of driving, I can't replicate it before that), the oil pressure gauge drops from 30 straight to 0. If I rev the engine a little, it shoots back up to 30, then in a second or two drops back to zero. Rinse and repeat, all of this while the engine is holding a strong idle (I wish these vans had tachs). Part of me thinks (hopes) it's a failing sensor or loose connection, but the other part of me thinks that the sensor only reads down to a value that the gauge reports as 30psi before dropping to 0.
Any thoughts/comments? I'll grab a new oil pressure sensor tomorrow, as they're in stock and only $30. Anything I should look for in the meantime?
#7
11-26-2022, 07:58 PM
Trending Topics
#8
11-27-2022, 07:14 PM
Further update:
The oil pressure sensor fixed the problem. I took the van to the hardware store today, about 20 miles, and had it stall on me once - acted like the torque converter didn't unlock again. It shuddered as I came to a stop like a manual if you don't push the clutch in. Put it in neutral, started it up, and it never happened again, the rest of the way there or the way back.
As the van isn't a primary form of transportation right now, I'm not too concerned with digging into that issue immediately. My gut is telling me to start with the TCC solenoid and see if there are any improvements.
The oil pressure sensor fixed the problem. I took the van to the hardware store today, about 20 miles, and had it stall on me once - acted like the torque converter didn't unlock again. It shuddered as I came to a stop like a manual if you don't push the clutch in. Put it in neutral, started it up, and it never happened again, the rest of the way there or the way back.
As the van isn't a primary form of transportation right now, I'm not too concerned with digging into that issue immediately. My gut is telling me to start with the TCC solenoid and see if there are any improvements.
#9
11-27-2022, 08:40 PM
#10
11-27-2022, 08:45 PM
Nope, no codes. Just basing it off of feeling. I think I remember seeing somewhere that they are *supposed* to throw a code and stop engaging the TCC until the code is cleared, but I'm not sure the validity of that. It still engages normally after stalling.