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Old Nov 5, 2021 | 06:36 PM
  #171  
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Originally Posted by HeyYou;[url=tel:3528956
3528956[/url]]Looks like the bolts have a collar that prevents them from spinning when you take of the nuts, but, of course, they will NOT prevent them from falling out, and disappearing, never to be seen again. At least, not until after the replacement bolts have been installed.

I'd say go for it. Get some of the graphite impregnated poly bushings, and tighten up the steering a wee bit as well. (do both sides..... )
If it wasn’t so simple looking to remove that arm I’d probably balk at it. I might even balk if the old crusty balljoint was still on it. But that’s not the case either. It’s almost screaming out, “Dammit Bronze, take me off!” There are two other advantages to taking the arm off. One, I can replace those bullet shaped snubbers on the bottom of the arm. I couldn’t do it with the arm on the truck. The new snubbers are a wee bit to tall. No working room. Two, I can properly torque those pivot bar nuts. Add a third…I can clean n paint the arm even though it really doesn’t need it. So HY votes in favor of removing the arm. I’m half a vote. Maybe Ralph will cast a ballot later.

Thinking about the bushings, the Energy Suspension poly bushings come as a set. Upper and lower control arms. And not cheap. $70. I can get standard ACDelco Pro rubber ones for $28. Are there other poly bushings to consider?
 
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Old Nov 6, 2021 | 12:09 AM
  #172  
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I'm for replacing the bushings.

I'm also for Poly - preferably the Prothane Black due to the graphite impregnation.

But the price difference is also worth considering.

Just remember, you'll have to realign it.

You MAY be able to do the swap with the poly without even releasing the balljoint.

If you DO replace the bushings yourself, do remember that the cross hatched side of the shaft goes towards the frame.

The bolts themselves have a "U" channel for the head; they can balked in and out, but should not fall out.

RwP
 
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Old Nov 6, 2021 | 07:16 AM
  #173  
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Originally Posted by RalphP
I'm for replacing the bushings.

I'm also for Poly - preferably the Prothane Black due to the graphite impregnation.

But the price difference is also worth considering.

Just remember, you'll have to realign it.

You MAY be able to do the swap with the poly without even releasing the balljoint.

If you DO replace the bushings yourself, do remember that the cross hatched side of the shaft goes towards the frame.

The bolts themselves have a "U" channel for the head; they can balked in and out, but should not fall out.

RwP
I can't find anything about Prothane Black being graphite impregnated. Perhaps I didn't look hard enough. Is it assumed all Prothane Black bushings are graphite impregnated?

While reading the differences between Prothane and Energy Suspension, it was thought ES was a better choice for dealing with temperature changes. This is now the second time I've had issues with upper control arm bushings. I'm wondering if there is something about Dakotas that attack upper control arm bushings more rapidly than other vehicles. Or perhaps that these bushings live very close to the exhaust manifold. Would ES be a viable alternative?

With both Prothane and ES, it appears I need to use the existing shells. I assume I'll have to burn out the old bushings and this will not warp or otherwise wreck the shell?? Also kinda eliminates the possibility of keeping the arm on the truck to change out bushings. And I'd have to burn out at least one side with the pivot bar still on the arm??

Either way, I'm kind of thinking the extra expense of a poly bushing is worth it seeing it appears the rubber bushings don't seem to have the durability in my Dakota. Perhaps poly will give me that extra durability. Both Prothane and ES sells kits so I have to buy both upper and lower control arm bushings in a set. Who knows, one day I may need the lowers. Or I just replace the lowers too while I'm part way there. Geez! And the shocks. Geez again!

***Update: I just noticed Prothane is a special order 10-12 week delivery. That kinda ruins it for Prothane.
 

Last edited by bronze; Nov 6, 2021 at 08:28 AM.
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Old Nov 6, 2021 | 12:33 PM
  #174  
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*dry* I'm old enough that at 12 years I'd've been replacing bushings ALREADY as a young'un.

And I'll point out that while I only have about eight years on mine, I also have over 200,000 miles, and they're still in great shape - being ES poly.

I'd keep those lowers, unless you want to replace them also. But that's where you have to start worrying about the spring and shock, since I don't think you can work on them with the suspension otherwise together (the lower control arm bushings, that is!)

Be prepared to either helicoil or some other way handle the threads in the LCA for the lower shock; I had to helicoil mine back when.

Speaking of shocks - I have a full set of KYB Gas-A-Justs to go on the car. The Ranchos have given up the ghost after a mere 45,000 miles. But I DO drive in Louisiana, Arkansas, Texas, and Oklahoma. Some of our roads - it's not the potholes that get you, it's the good road between!

RwP
 
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Old Nov 6, 2021 | 12:58 PM
  #175  
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Originally Posted by RalphP
*dry* I'm old enough that at 12 years I'd've been replacing bushings ALREADY as a young'un.

And I'll point out that while I only have about eight years on mine, I also have over 200,000 miles, and they're still in great shape - being ES poly.

I'd keep those lowers, unless you want to replace them also. But that's where you have to start worrying about the spring and shock, since I don't think you can work on them with the suspension otherwise together (the lower control arm bushings, that is!)

Be prepared to either helicoil or some other way handle the threads in the LCA for the lower shock; I had to helicoil mine back when.

Speaking of shocks - I have a full set of KYB Gas-A-Justs to go on the car. The Ranchos have given up the ghost after a mere 45,000 miles. But I DO drive in Louisiana, Arkansas, Texas, and Oklahoma. Some of our roads - it's not the potholes that get you, it's the good road between!

RwP
Ralph, I decided I'm going to change out both upper and lower control arm bushings. I've been violating my tenets lately and piecemealing jobs that should not be piecemealed. This is ridiculous. Piecemealing has its place but not on a 28 year old truck suspension that I plan on keeping around for awhile. I should have changed it all out back when I did the ball joints and tie rods. You intimated that is what you did and more than once. I should have listened to you AND me. But that's here nor there. I'm replacing all of it. I'm going to order the ES bushings because they are available all over the place while Prothane is special order. I can't wait three months for bushings.

As for that spring (I beg you to differ if I am wrong because they do scare the hell out of me), I'm planning to detach the shock, tie rod, end link, and de-knuckle the upper ball joint (leaving the castle nut on) while I have the jack supporting the LCA. Then I will sloooooowly let the jack down to release the tension on that spring. I think that is being safe as long as I'm being careful about letting down the jack. Agree? Also, can I just detach the shock at the bottom only?
 
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Old Nov 6, 2021 | 01:43 PM
  #176  
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Originally Posted by RalphP
*dry* I'm old enough that at 12 years I'd've been replacing bushings ALREADY as a young'un.

And I'll point out that while I only have about eight years on mine, I also have over 200,000 miles, and they're still in great shape - being ES poly.

I'd keep those lowers, unless you want to replace them also. But that's where you have to start worrying about the spring and shock, since I don't think you can work on them with the suspension otherwise together (the lower control arm bushings, that is!)

Be prepared to either helicoil or some other way handle the threads in the LCA for the lower shock; I had to helicoil mine back when.

Speaking of shocks - I have a full set of KYB Gas-A-Justs to go on the car. The Ranchos have given up the ghost after a mere 45,000 miles. But I DO drive in Louisiana, Arkansas, Texas, and Oklahoma. Some of our roads - it's not the potholes that get you, it's the good road between!

RwP
The LCA shock threads? I don't have threads for the shock in the LCA. Not that I remember anyway. Wait, maybe I do. I'll check it out. Thanks for the head's up. What happened with yours? Corrosion then stripped them when taking off?
 
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Old Nov 6, 2021 | 03:50 PM
  #177  
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I'm going to clean and paint the arms while I have them off. I know there is a little surface rust on the underside of the LCAs. I'll wire/sand it off. Any special kind of primer or rust neutralizer I should use prior to final paint?

Also, I know ES includes grease for these bushings. In the event they skimp, would Sil Glyde work?
 

Last edited by bronze; Nov 6, 2021 at 03:56 PM.
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Old Nov 6, 2021 | 04:57 PM
  #178  
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1: It SHOULD be enough, but I was a chicken; I used a coil spring compressor, one of the through-center ones, like this one OEMTOOLS Coil Spring Compressor (autozone.com) .

I used the upper shock hole as my upper mount, and the hooks under as the lower point.

That worked for me.

2: I meant the two bolts for the lower shock mount; they thread into the lower control arm, and it's thin there (the helicoil was about half out the top of it with it flush on the bottom.)

And no, the shock mount ears won't fit through the hole in the LCA.

3: Probably; just plan on spraying the joints with some silicon or PTFE spray every oil and filter change to keep it from EEKook ing at you.

Since you have new ball joints in, you can't just take it to a powder coat shop so I'd go for a quality rust preventing paint after wire brushing the rust off. Maybe start with a rust reformer? If I ever redo mine from scratch with new bushings, I'll just get my powder coater to media blast it and powder coat it.

RwP
 
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Old Nov 6, 2021 | 06:31 PM
  #179  
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The KYB Gas A Justs at Autozone are $63 ea.. The same shock at RockAuto is $32. Seriously? Twice the price at Autozone?

I put Monroe Sensa Traks on my ‘93 back in 2010. Only have about 33,000 miles on them so they are still working just fine. I plan on keeping them. I would put KYBs on if I were changing them out. I always thought those Ranchos were good the little I know about them. I guess not.

KYB is running a rebate. $25 if you buy 4. I’ll probably get 4 struts for the wife’s Jeep. Just the strut, not the assy. I think the rebate runs thru Nov.
 
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Old Nov 7, 2021 | 08:39 AM
  #180  
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Originally Posted by RalphP
1: It SHOULD be enough, but I was a chicken; I used a coil spring compressor, one of the through-center ones, like this one OEMTOOLS Coil Spring Compressor (autozone.com) .

I used the upper shock hole as my upper mount, and the hooks under as the lower point.

That worked for me.

RwP
That spring compressor looks much friendlier and effective for compressing springs still on the vehicle versus the more common 2-bracket setup (where the brackets clamp 180 degrees opposite one another). The 2-bracket system looks better suited for bench work...like transferring springs on strut shocks.

Questions:
1) You said you go through the upper shock hole to use as the upper compressor mount with the hooks grasping on the lower portion of the coil. Does this mean you do not use that shoe/fork component in the compressor kit? And if true, you're simply tightening the compressor with a ratchet or air gun from the top?

2) I'm trying to picture how you set this up. Do you take the hook end off and feed the threaded shaft from above thru the upper shock hole first then reattach the hook end at the bottom?

3) So then the spring is compressed against the upper shock mount. With the lower spring end inserted into the holding pocket on the LCA, I'm assuming the LCA is still attached post-compression? How do you de-pocket that lower coil end? After you remove the pivot bolts on the LCA?

4) I'm thinking I will want to detach all my arms so I can clean n paint them all at once. Seems I could easily de-compress the spring on the first side after the LCA is removed and then use the compressor for the other side. No?

5) Would I even need to compress the spring to reassemble?

Or am I totally not seeing how you worked this compressor kit (likely, lol)?

 
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