http://www.autoblog.com/2008/12/12/w...omakers-backs/

 

union playing hardball, as usual. they know the white house will cave in and give them money without any concessions, or it'll be reworked in congress in round 2 w/o concessions.

 

I think they need to cut wages and restructure or else they need to go bankrupt. I don't want to the second option happen, but its the only way to fix the problem if they won't do it themselves.

 

Yep, it is time to AXE the unions!!

 

its not just the unions, come on, multi million dollar bonuses, private jets, some of these corporate cronies are makeing upwards of 4grand A DAY, look at citi bank their ceo is seeking his 10 million bonus for this year, and we the tax payer bailed them out. hell, give me 1 million bucks ill run your corporation in the ground and dissapear and seek nothing else.

 

yeah i don't understand why these guys are destroying the companies they should be working for and are still getting paid an exorbanent amount of money for it... pay them a dollar a year (nardelli offered to take it) and if they don't work, kick their asses to the curb... if they do, have bonuses structrued so that they are performance oriented which will really make them want to make more, therfore work harder and smarter

 

Obama pretty much made it clear the other day that he feels that if they can't turn things around, the three leaders need to go!!
I said earlier that the UAW needs to go, and yes they need to rethink the way that the upper management is paid. There is no way that a CEo should get a bonus from a company that is losing money.
The CEO of Ford did this when he hired on from Boeing. He would not accept any sign-on bonus until they were profitable. What bonuses that were paid were used to buy out his remaining contract with Boeing, not personal use.
I think that all upper management needs a reality check.

 

Yes how dare those of us on the line make a decent living! Its all our fault. We pick the product we build, we advertise it, we determine line speed, and how much work is on a job(which directly effects quality.) So yes it's we the UAW workers that should pay the price for all these bad decisions. Oh wait, management makes those decisions, not the guy on the line just trying to feed his family. It's the guys making $500,000 -$ 25,000,000 that make those calls. We are not the reason we are in this mess. Here are the main reasons...

1. Americans are too stupid to realize that we are outsourcing ourselves. And we seem to be quite content doing it. Who cares if I'm putting Americans out of work I want my toyota!

2. The American government a. puts on huge regulations to the automakers. b. overseen the complete credit meltdown this year. c. allows huge trade difference with us and other countries.

3. The wall street bailout was a failure. Most still are having a hard time getting financing. Plus it is quite common for large companies to borrow money from time to time. Which is what we would have done, if the banks were actually lending money instead of holding on to it.

4. Poor choices by management. On product mix, and lack of development. But to their defense up until the past year or so Americans did want their full size trucks and suv's. But we should of had a better backup plan.

Here is a very realistic scenario if the big 3 file chap 11.

First of all more likely than not Chrysler will not survive the process. Almost 50 percent of our suppliers will go out of business due to unpaid bills because of the bankruptcy. Almost 40 percent of the big 3 dealers will close. Because of sales tanking. I mean really who would buy a car from a bankrupt automaker? Also those of you that have warranties... Sorry those are now null and void. You are now considered a creditor to the companies. Sucks to be you.

So now with far less sales even more plants, engineers, designers, and such will be laid off. Not to mention all of chrysler. So with all the layoffs that will be oh about half a million to 1 million people out of work directly to the automakers, suppliers, and dealers. We won't even get into the ripple effect.

You think the housing market is bad now? Put a million people out of work, see how many file chap 11 themselves, and foreclose on their homes.

Now lets look at the remaining hourly workers under a chap 11. Lets say the company says instead of the 27/hr we currently make (not this 70+/hr nonsense) now you make 15/hr. So now every remaining autoworker just took a $480 a week pay cut. Thats a $2080 cut monthly, $24960 cut yearly. How many of us do you think would turn around and file chap 11, or 13. How many Billions will get lost in personal, and business bankruptcy? Who knows. The housing market will most likely completely crash, and so will many of the banks we just bailed out.

Oh I almost forgot GM alone has almost 1 million people depending on it for heath care. Guess who that bill will go to after this?

So yeah bankruptcy sounds like a very good idea to me how about you?

 

a few things...

alot of people in this country live comfortably making less than youre talking about in your post. sure, they dont live like the jeffersons, but they lead happy lives with less money than that. that could be one of the reasons that so few people are sympathetic of the issue. however, i dont blame the workers for the issue between the government and the union. shapman probably didnt get much say in what the union did with the bailout meetings, but the union leaders sure did...as ive said in my other posts, my issue isnt with the union workers as much as it is the union itself.

arent toyota camrys built in kentucky? the way that i see it, i imagine that they are hiring american workers to man that plant. the cost of shipping workers over here would be ridiculous, so that plant probably employs a fair number of americans. those camrys are probably loaded onto a hauler and driven by an american worker to a dealership...where the car is then cleaned by a porter who is more than likely american, then eventually sold by someone who is more than likely an american worker. granted, i believe that none of these guys are union workers (except maybe the truck driver?), but as a consumer, in either case im technically supporting a handful of american workers in buying a camry, but if i buy a challenger, the only americans i might be supporting are the dealership folks, since theyre made in canada. youre suggesting that we should buy cars built by union labor, but as a consumer using the layout above, im supporting more americans in buying a camry than i am in buying a challenger...and whether or not its union built is irrelevant to most consumers (who dont have a union job).

how would you classify my laser? its a DSM, built in normal, il...but its nothing more than a mitsubishi eclipse...

 

Well said..

I can say for a fact that it takes more work to do my job, then it does for the average line worker in a union....because unlike my job, after about the 50th time installing something very repetitive, you should know how to do it.

Bottom line, I just think alot of us are tired of the woe is me crap from people who make a ton of money compared to the average guy......right or wrong....but right now people dont have sympathy for people whining about a paycut, when others are already losing their jobs, homes, and other stuff...


To be honest with you, if the Unions dont want to take the paycut....I'd replace them with workers who'll work for less.

I can guarantee you the average US worker would gladly take a job making $20-25hr as opposed to $8-15hr...