Hello everyone,

I'm seeking information concerning the swap that I'm currently underway with, which is taking my 3.9 2WD 5Speed and dropping in a 5.2, keeping the 2WD 5Speed.

My truck is a 93. The 318 I acquired is out of an automatic, 4WD, 96 Dakota (ended up being a sweet deal, saw it run, was quiet, smooth, and had better oil pressure than I ever came close to with my 3.9. And it only has 48,000 Miles!!!!!). I also have a computer from a 93-94 318Auto that I'd like to use in this swap. So far I've pulled my 3.9 and AX-15 out of my truck, and also picked up the 318 and got the accessories and harness removed.

So far I've got 3 things holding me up, that I'm a bit confused about.
First, I see this 96 motor has a return-less fuel rail setup. I assume I'll have to get a return-style v8 fuel rail from the junkyard to match up to my return-style truck and fuel pump. Is this correct, and will I need to get the older injectors from the junkyard truck, or can I keep the injectors that came with my 96 motor and just splice on the plugs onto my harness?

Second, the clutch. I have figured out I'll need a new flywheel for the swap, but I'm not sure which one, same as the clutch. They seem to come in different sizes (10.5, 11, and an "upgraded" 12 inch). What do I need to mate my 318 to my AX-15?

Third, the computer situation. Since I'm using an automatic computer (was the only v8 computer I could find locally) with a manual harness and trans, what do I have to do to make them play well together?

Any help is appreciated guys!
If there's an interest, pics may come!

 

Is your six port fuel injected, or throttle body?

The PCM will run the engine just fine, but, it will whine about the lack of action when it tries to tell the auto trans (that isn't there....) to do something. No avoiding that one, without some custom programming. (read that: Big Money.)

See if you can find a manual trans PCM on ebay, or whatnot.

 

Hello,

My V6 was multi-port fuel injection, same as the 318 that's going in it's place.

I understand what you're saying but I didn't think (but don't really know) that the PCM really "did" anything with the automatic trannys in 93, considering they still have the "tv" or "kickdown" cable.

I will buy a manual 318 computer if I must, but was hoping all I'd have to do is fool the automatic PCM into thinking my truck was in park or neutral, so it'd start. I have no problem with doing wiring, I do wiring on firetrucks for a living, I just don't know how it applies to dodge's if you get what I'm saying.

 

The newer ones still have the cable as well. Only thing PCM does on the RH transmissions is TCC, and O/D. PCM will complain that it isn't seeing RPM drop when commanding either...... It doesn't play a role in the starting circuit.... and convincing it it is still in park, or neutral, may have undesireable effects as well. (some manufacturers lean the mixture out in park, or neutral...... which when under load, would lead to spark knock, or worse.....)

The six has a return style fuel system??? I didn't think dodge did that trick..... (along with their lack of knock sensors.......)

 

Hmm, like I said, I'm not against getting a manual PCM, but just brainstorming here; maybe I could put the neutral safety switch wire from the PCM to a switch. Turn it on (so it thinks its in P/N and lets it start) to start it, then when started, turn it off, so it thinks it's in drive and would hopefully avoid the bad things you mentioned?

Yep, my 93 V6 has a return type rail, it has 2 braided hoses going to it, with the fuel pressure regulator mounted to the rail, where as the 96 318 I have only had one fuel hose going to it (and supposedly the regulator is in the tank with the pump, since it's not on the rail like my older v6).

I appreciate your help by the way, feels good to not be completely lost lol!


EDIT: Just noticed you said the PCM doesn't play a role in the starting circuit, do you mean if I had a first gen dakota with an automatic trans, that I could start it with it in gear? I thought there was a park/neutral safety switch so that it couldn't be started in gear (every automatic I ever had was like this, granted they weren't trucks, or as old as a first gen dakota).

 

They did until 1994; my 1988 is return style. Well, the 1987 may not have been, and I'm not sure the feed back carbed I4s were, but again, my 1988 3.9 is.

There is a park/neutral safety switch; it's just not connected to the PCM. The one does not require the other. Shucks, my 1967 Mustang and my 1967 Chevy both had'em. (My even older vehicles were standards ...)

RwP

 

I "think" you can use a 94 and up flywheel for the 318. Its a 143 tooth, same as the V6 but you need the 5.2 flywheel for the crank position sensor. Also, you will need a manual crank position sensor. They are different from the auto version. But your orig. V6 may be the same.
Clutch for the V8 used the same 1.125 10T shaft, but is a 11in and up..... That being said, I believe the V6 10.5 is drilled for a smaller bolt pattern (pressure plate). FWIW I would try the 11in rather then the 12. (that is what I used on my 87) If things get out of hand, I would rather slip a clutch and replace in time then to break the transmission. Not to mention the additional rotational mass of the 12 in vs the 11 in....
For injectors, I thought the flow rate was different on the 93-94 OBD1 vs the 96 and up OBD2 but could not find anything showing flow rates.... That would be my main concern with injectors.
You may want to do a search on this forum for member ragged89. He installed a 93-94? 5.2 in his 89 along with the factory injection and harness. Really smart guy and he posted a lot of pictures and details along the way.

One other point. We know dakota went to the magnum series engines in 92. But with the 5.2 they did not offer a manual trans until 94. So keep that in mind when looking for parts.


Edit to say, please add pictures!! We love pictures!

 

Alright first, sorry for my terribly late response. I put together some pics to make up for the long wait lol.

I don't think I was thinking about it correctly in the past, but I hear what your saying now. Since my harness is a mtx harness, I have no safety switch. So the auto computer (having it's hissy-fit about no trans) should work.

I was prepared to go to the junkyard yesterday and today and grab the return-style fuel rail and 8 injectors I need, but that'll have to wait until this coming weekend due to the snow we got yesterday. In the meantime I may try to see if I can find specs on the different years of injectors, as I really would rather use the 48K Mile 96 injectors, rather than paying to get junk, junkyard injectors.

Now to catch up on the pics!
Here's the results of the first day of stripping down the trashed V6:


The second day: I labeled all of the connections, except the transmission plugs, as they were too hard to reach. I now realize this was not necessary as I now know all of the plugs after taking the harnesses off of both motors lol

When freeing up my transmission I noticed that rubber boot there was torn completely between the ribs, thus allowing all of the muddy water I've ever driven though into the transmission
I pulled the motor out with a friend after finishing up freeing everything up. Used a forklift there instead of trying to use a hoist in snow and mud at home. The motor and trans (still connected) was tossed in the bed and then the truck towed home.
Here is my 318 and newly purchased HF 2 Ton Engine Hoist in the back of my cousins nice 97 Ram. Just under 40,000 Miles on that truck, and not one speck of rust!
Here's the 318 with the harness and accessories stripped off of it and mounted to my new HF 2000Lb Engine Stand. I will say I'm glad I went with the biggest hoist and engine stand that HF sells, as they both held the weight of that fully dressed 318 and I feel confident working around them with that much weight.
Here's the 318 with my AX-15 that I just dismounted from the back of the V6 a few days ago, and wrestled it out of the back of the truck.

As you can see, my garage has no room, everything I did with the truck was done outside, in snow and mud. It'll all be worth it when it's done. Yesterday I also started pulling everything (literally) out of the engine bay to paint it hopefully soon, although I'm not sure what to do with my front fenders, as the front of both, and back of one is rusting away.

EDIT: Also wanted to add that I'd like to use my trucks original 93 Y pipe, rather than the downsized 96, so I may be putting headers on the 318 before I put it into the truck. Also want to ask for some advice as to what brand flywheel and clutch to get. I usually order off of RockAuto, but I'm open to suggestions, and am also unsure if I should just get a stock clutch or an upgraded one.

Stay tuned everyone, and thanks again!

 

Nice, great timing. As of a few days ago I grenaded my 3.9 and so I'm doing the exact same swap in the exact same year, just a 4wd instead. I've done enough research to know what I need but it's awesome to have it all here in one place where I can follow you.

I already got a flywheel from Standard Flywheels to replace whatever is attached to the motor I buy. Can't review it yet and looks like it's only available on eBay for absurdly expensive prices. Looks like the best option now is the ATP Z368 on RockAuto. I'm sure it's fine. It's up to you but when it's appropriate for the specific flywheel, I always take the step to have it resurfaced by a machine shop because I do not trust the stock surface at all. I've already had it done with mine. Just worth it for me to know I don't have to pull the motor again because I know I have a perfectly flat flywheel, with a good surface and with no contaminants hiding in the pits of the stock surface that isn't going to give me issues.

edit: I also plan to get a stock v8 clutch because it is more than capable of holding way more than the stock engine can put out. Also I plan on getting a Luk kit because I *think* they were the OEM manufacturer of Dodge back when...not that that necessarily means anything, but that's the best intel I've got so I'm going with it.

edit2: can't find any evidence of what I claimed above about Luk being the OEM manufacturer. Anyway I'd either go with Luk or Sachs from the RockAuto available flywheels clutches because I know the names. Yes you could get the larger 12" clutch but it's truly not necessary.

 

Hello,

Believe it or not I just read through your thread before making my last post here lol Sorry to hear about your motor, but hey, at least we're both making the best of it with some v8 power!

Thanks for the suggestions on either ATP, Luk, or Sachs. The only reason I was considering an upgraded clutch is so I'd have room for future upgrades. I'm already almost definitely doing headers with the big 93 Y-Pipe, and plan on a nice big air cleaner, and not too far down the road, Harland Sharp 1.7 Roller Rockers, and who knows, maybe I can get my hands on a mopar performance PCM.

Did you already acquire your v8, and if so, what mileage is on it?