Valve Timing Questions
#11
#12
#13
wait, wait, wait...
+4 is advancing the cam, which increases low end power (slightly) by causing valve events to happen faster in relation to piston travel. The quicker closing intake valve helps build a bit more cylinder pressure and is desirable on a street truck.
-4 is retarding the cam which should help the higher end (slightly) as the valve events happen later in the piston stroke. Only do this if you've got a very specific build and you happen to be peaking out just before hitting the end of the 1/4 mile. It'll extend the high end power just a bit, but is also a bit more sluggish on the street.
I do agree that the gains either way will be minimal on a stock cam.
Here's a good read on camshafts and all the factors to consider:
http://www.circletrack.com/techartic...e/viewall.html
If that picture posted earlier in post #10 is the newer Mopar TC, it's good they've changed it. The old design had a tiny little dot that was actually the correct one to use when lining up the crank sprocket. Be wary if you have the older chain.
+4 is advancing the cam, which increases low end power (slightly) by causing valve events to happen faster in relation to piston travel. The quicker closing intake valve helps build a bit more cylinder pressure and is desirable on a street truck.
-4 is retarding the cam which should help the higher end (slightly) as the valve events happen later in the piston stroke. Only do this if you've got a very specific build and you happen to be peaking out just before hitting the end of the 1/4 mile. It'll extend the high end power just a bit, but is also a bit more sluggish on the street.
I do agree that the gains either way will be minimal on a stock cam.
Here's a good read on camshafts and all the factors to consider:
http://www.circletrack.com/techartic...e/viewall.html
If that picture posted earlier in post #10 is the newer Mopar TC, it's good they've changed it. The old design had a tiny little dot that was actually the correct one to use when lining up the crank sprocket. Be wary if you have the older chain.
Last edited by aim4squirrels; 07-10-2012 at 12:18 PM.
#14
I debated this question with myself (happens quite often) and wondered...how often do I need low end vs top end....and the result was...Don't really know. Unless one uses truck for highway only and no towing or in town driving, top end may be the answer (but may be a dog getting there...) and if one is towing and pulling a load all the time, then low end. But then, for a highway machine, Rams ae NOT really an economical choice.....And the 46Re for heavy towing and pulling...not so much either.
So I opted for normal instead of +4 or -4, and let the SCT tune work to make truck the most useful.
mine isn't necessarily a daily driver, although I am on the highway quite often, using a truck with better mileage, and I do pull an occasional trailer.
Personal preference and what one wants to do with the truck again, I suppose, would be the correct choice.
So I opted for normal instead of +4 or -4, and let the SCT tune work to make truck the most useful.
mine isn't necessarily a daily driver, although I am on the highway quite often, using a truck with better mileage, and I do pull an occasional trailer.
Personal preference and what one wants to do with the truck again, I suppose, would be the correct choice.
#15
Top end isn't for the highway either.
Think about what is really the top end: We're talking 4500-5500 RPM's. When are you turning those kinds of RPMs? Not on the highway cruising along. Even if you're towing in 3rd with the OD off, you're not approaching those RPMs. Only at the track do you need those kinds of gains. For a truck that gets driven and not raced, lower end power is what you want.
You don't need top end for the on-ramp either. Even with a low end built truck, you'll accelerate just fine on the ramp when you floor the skinny pedal, trust me.
I think guys muddle their heads up about top end because we read so many articles about racing and their specific needs that we just automatically port them over to our vehicles without really mulling it over.
500WHP sounds bada$$ until you think about how often you really need it. That's why the only mods I've done to my Challenger have been efficiency, sound, and looks. The thing can get into the 12's stock with decent tires. I don't really NEED faster, it's just want at that point.
I'll admit, lately I've been trying to convince myself that I don't NEED that sweet Kenne Bell 2.8L liquid-cooled blower in the black finish.
Think about what is really the top end: We're talking 4500-5500 RPM's. When are you turning those kinds of RPMs? Not on the highway cruising along. Even if you're towing in 3rd with the OD off, you're not approaching those RPMs. Only at the track do you need those kinds of gains. For a truck that gets driven and not raced, lower end power is what you want.
You don't need top end for the on-ramp either. Even with a low end built truck, you'll accelerate just fine on the ramp when you floor the skinny pedal, trust me.
I think guys muddle their heads up about top end because we read so many articles about racing and their specific needs that we just automatically port them over to our vehicles without really mulling it over.
500WHP sounds bada$$ until you think about how often you really need it. That's why the only mods I've done to my Challenger have been efficiency, sound, and looks. The thing can get into the 12's stock with decent tires. I don't really NEED faster, it's just want at that point.
I'll admit, lately I've been trying to convince myself that I don't NEED that sweet Kenne Bell 2.8L liquid-cooled blower in the black finish.
#16
wait, wait, wait...
+4 is advancing the cam, which increases low end power (slightly) by causing valve events to happen faster in relation to piston travel. The quicker closing intake valve helps build a bit more cylinder pressure and is desirable on a street truck.
-4 is retarding the cam which should help the higher end (slightly) as the valve events happen later in the piston stroke. Only do this if you've got a very specific build and you happen to be peaking out just before hitting the end of the 1/4 mile. It'll extend the high end power just a bit, but is also a bit more sluggish on the street.
I do agree that the gains either way will be minimal on a stock cam.
Here's a good read on camshafts and all the factors to consider:
http://www.circletrack.com/techartic...e/viewall.html
If that picture posted earlier in post #10 is the newer Mopar TC, it's good they've changed it. The old design had a tiny little dot that was actually the correct one to use when lining up the crank sprocket. Be wary if you have the older chain.
+4 is advancing the cam, which increases low end power (slightly) by causing valve events to happen faster in relation to piston travel. The quicker closing intake valve helps build a bit more cylinder pressure and is desirable on a street truck.
-4 is retarding the cam which should help the higher end (slightly) as the valve events happen later in the piston stroke. Only do this if you've got a very specific build and you happen to be peaking out just before hitting the end of the 1/4 mile. It'll extend the high end power just a bit, but is also a bit more sluggish on the street.
I do agree that the gains either way will be minimal on a stock cam.
Here's a good read on camshafts and all the factors to consider:
http://www.circletrack.com/techartic...e/viewall.html
If that picture posted earlier in post #10 is the newer Mopar TC, it's good they've changed it. The old design had a tiny little dot that was actually the correct one to use when lining up the crank sprocket. Be wary if you have the older chain.
#17
What cam are you using? You will not feel the diff from -4 to +4 set it at 0 and forget it. If you are using an aftermarket cam then things might be a little different and that depends on the cams grind pattern. What differential do you have in that truck 3.73? not for the 9.25 rear.
Last edited by MeanMagnum99; 07-10-2012 at 01:55 PM.
#18
Ooops. I sit corrected.
+4 is advancing the cam. Good for low end grunt.
-4 is retarding the cam, more for top end power.
Reference here.
Considering that our intake manifolds are flat out LOUSY for top end power, I don't think you would see much of a gain by retarding the cam, you WOULD notice the loss down low though.
+4 is advancing the cam. Good for low end grunt.
-4 is retarding the cam, more for top end power.
Reference here.
Considering that our intake manifolds are flat out LOUSY for top end power, I don't think you would see much of a gain by retarding the cam, you WOULD notice the loss down low though.
#19
Ooops. I sit corrected.
+4 is advancing the cam. Good for low end grunt.
-4 is retarding the cam, more for top end power.
Reference here.
Considering that our intake manifolds are flat out LOUSY for top end power, I don't think you would see much of a gain by retarding the cam, you WOULD notice the loss down low though.
+4 is advancing the cam. Good for low end grunt.
-4 is retarding the cam, more for top end power.
Reference here.
Considering that our intake manifolds are flat out LOUSY for top end power, I don't think you would see much of a gain by retarding the cam, you WOULD notice the loss down low though.
#20